I fell victim to the flooding issue yesterday and couldn't be happier with the service I received from Mazda 24 hour roadside assistance.
My car was in the driveway last Tuesday when my wife started it up and pulled it into the garage then turned it off about 45 seconds later....ouch!!!!
I was out of town and she didn't know no any better. Well this past Sunday, I head out to take her for a spin and all I got was a lot of cranking and no turn over. Since my wife was unaware of the potential problem with flooding, I only mildly beat her..(just kidding)
Anyway, I called Mazda RSA and there is a platform tow truck at my door within a 1/2 hour. Of course the dealer is closed on Sunday but my car was diagnosed as "flooded" on Monday morning by my Mazda dealer so they changed the plugs and oil. They also took care of the air bag issue while it was in the shop. Bottom line, I had it back by lunch with a free oil change and the air bag recall resolved. Yes..the flooding is a problem but this thread was meant to praise the superior service of the 24 hour RSA.....

Glad to hear you received prompt service with no hassle and had the job done by noon. I hope I don't have the same problem because I don't think I have RSA :(

Nice to know the raodside assistance is great service.

I think everybody (at least the original purchaser) gets the RSA - didn't you get the punch-out hang tag with the 800 number on it when you took delivery of your car?

I think it is good for the same period of time as the warranty.

I am glad to hear of the GREAT service you received - nice to know!

please educate anyone who drives your cars !!! this will cut down on all the griping !!!!

Flooding victim here too, and also great service from RSA. At the time of the issue, my dealsership had no idea how to fix this problem. Mind you I was the first to buy an 8 at this dealership in Aug 03, so i had to wait 2 days to get mine back. Still received excellent service all the way around!

Please educate the engineers at Mazda that a flooding car is a flooding car. A flooded RX8 is no better than a Porsche left on cinder blocks.

My 10 year old Nissan Altima simply starts every time. Even with an old battery and plugs in -10F weather. Hot, cold, rainy, humid, it just starts. I started it the other day, forgot something in the house and shut if off after running for only 10 seconds. Came back 2 minutes later and it started right up and I drove it.

Getting 25-30 MPG with gas approaching $2.00 here (and even higher elsewhere) makes sitting on the fence no longer an issue. I should delete the bookmark to this site, but I'm fascinated at the attempts by people on the bleeding edge to justify the purchase of their "baby".

JaegerNH, come on- this is trolling man......

the RX8 is not bleeding edge at all. I have never flooding mine. it's so simple- just let it warm up..... so simple... anyone who drives my 8 knows this. I'll admit valet parking could be an issue, but who wants a valet to take you car anyway?


But it is nice to know if it does happen roadside assistance is there and knows how to deal with it. (though I never expect to need it)


EDIT: come to think of it- you can valet your car- when dropping it off- there is no need for anyone to move it generally until you pick it up (you can also confirm this). WHen you hand your ticket in- just tell them to keep it running, and walk up to the car as it is pulling up- tip in hand, and reiterate "keep it running"

Problem solved.

How about educating YOURSELF? This isn't a new issue, it's inherent and known. We're talking about a rotary engine, not an old truck engine stuffed into a dull, plain ass sedan.

JaegerNH - I purchased my 8 because I had the funds available and for the first time in my life could buy a car that I desired and not just that I could afford. I have a child on the way and the 8s two + two half doors make it possible to transport said child with a bit more ease than a typical 2 door. I think the car is breathtaking. I think the car handles well. I think the car accelerates fast enough (I've had three tickets over 100mph in a 88 Honda Civic CRX, a much slower car).

I bought my car for my reasons. Every person on this planet has opinions, you for example, think that MPG is very important while it carries less weight with me (I have a 7 mile commute to work). You also believe that flooding is a foregone conclusion with the 8 I, however, think that by following the instructions in the manual the problem can be avoided and thus is not an issue (most of the flooding have been from folks who were oblivious to the wankels sensitiveity to temperature).

I make no excuses for my purchase because I bought what I wanted, hence I love my car.

Originally posted by JaegerNH
Please educate the engineers at Mazda that a flooding car is a flooding car. A flooded RX8 is no better than a Porsche left on cinder blocks.

My 10 year old Nissan Altima simply starts every time. Even with an old battery and plugs in -10F weather. Hot, cold, rainy, humid, it just starts. I started it the other day, forgot something in the house and shut if off after running for only 10 seconds. Came back 2 minutes later and it started right up and I drove it.

Getting 25-30 MPG with gas approaching $2.00 here (and even higher elsewhere) makes sitting on the fence no longer an issue. I should delete the bookmark to this site, but I'm fascinated at the attempts by people on the bleeding edge to justify the purchase of their "baby".

THIS IS NOT A GODDAMNED ALTIMA !!! unfortunately the rotary exists in a world built around pistons.,

When are people going to get it thru their thick f-ing skulls that this is just one of the quirks of a rotary engine ?!?!?!?!?! There are a bunch of rotary rookies buying this car who have no clue as to the nuances and common practices that are needed with a rotary. Consequently, because they are idiots and uneducated...... Mazda has made a bad car ??!?!?! Kiss my ass. I just had a long chat with two rotary techs today who were laughing their asses off about some dipshit complaining about this exact problem. I joined in with them. When asked how long I've been dealing with these engines my response was "11 years." Their reply to that was........ "oh, so you expected this....." ABSOLUTELY.

This is my baby and it's an improvement over my last baby and this flooding "issue" which really isn't an issue at all doesn't bother me in the least.

Rant off.

I don't think Mazda wants to sell the 8 to only those already familiar with the rotary engine. Those rotary rookies are the new customers that will make the 8 a larger sales success.

If a lot of cars flood it could give the 8 a bad public rep. This could negatively impact sales and resale value. It's a warranty cost item for Mazda. There could be less funding for further development.

Of course, I can't say that these undesirable things will definitely result, but because the car does have a wider appeal than the 7 may have had, I think the flooding quirk needs attention and I hope it can be engineered out.

DO make sure RSA sends a platform tow truck. They did NOT in my case.

Jagernh is a troll.
I looked over all his posts. He does not even own an 8. He drives some girly-girl econobox and worries about mpg and rants about the wankel flooding.
I bought the coolest car. Nordic Green. It is a blast. I have never flooded it. I get 12mpg sometimes. So what. I wanted it and I got it. The next car I get may be a Testarossa, or a corvette or a Jag XJR. Whatever I get it will be because I like it. And I won't be sitting around listening to some high schooler who can't afford to put gas in his minivan tell me what a piece of crap my expensive car is because of XYZ. Go troll the fishpond for carp dudeette.

Regardless of what you say and who is or isn't trolling, point is that Mazda will need to do something about the flooding problem or the 8 is likely to be both the rebirth of and the last gasp of the rotary.

Those of us who are rotary enthusiasts understand the nature of the engine, but point is is that the driver who just wants a sports car won't stand for it, nor will the person who just wants a cool, sporty car.

It of course has long been a foregone conclusion that the 8 would appeal to rotary fans, but to be a long term commercial success it has to tantalize the everyday car buyer as well...

And that would be what? What are they going to do about flooding? If my car has not flooded is it really a problem with the rotory design or a fluke (or varience or whatever you wish to call it) that must be delt with a change in operational behavior by the user. Perhaps there is not a fix for flooding except user education. What then, do you think it spells the demise of the rotary engine. I think it likely that rotary engines may be used in light aircraft soon, I doubt that they will fade from view.

Originally posted by crumpmd
Jagernh is a troll.
I looked over all his posts. He does not even own an 8. He drives some girly-girl econobox and worries about mpg and rants about the wankel flooding.


Way to go Sherlock Holmes! Considering most of my postings stated clearly that I had not bought one because of mpg and flooding problems in the first line, you're quite perceptive. Wow, and I thought the whole thing about guys using a car to compensate for shortcomings in other areas was just an urban legend.

Congratulations on your 12mpg. I'm sure all your friends are quite impressed at your gas purchasing prowess. You da man!
Your next car might be a Testarossa? Errrr... sure dude whatever you say. Maybe you can pick me and my girlfriend up in it. Perhaps you know her, she's currently the reigning Miss America.

Your expensive car is a piece of crap for the following reasons:
X. It's expensive
Y. It's unreliable
Z. It attracts people like you to it

Hmm this thread has some interesting points, and some not so interesting points. The one I want to hear more opinions on is what Mazda is going to do about the flooding issue. If they want the car to be a commercial success they will have to fix it. There are lots of people who don't know anything about rotary engines who will flood this engine. Heck even people who know all about rotary engines can flood it. And a engine that floods more often than never will not sell as one that never floods. Bottom line, if Mazda wants to market the RX-8 to a large audience, which I think they do, they will need to fix the flooding issue. Now...what I want to know is how this is going to be done. The only thing I can think of is a slight redesign in the engine, which probably won't occur until the 2006 models....Maybe 2005. Anyone else have any other opinions on how the flooding issue will be solved?

Originally posted by JaegerNH
Way to go Sherlock Holmes!

This thread is a waste of electrons....

JaegerNH: hooray, you didn't buy the car, now go away.

I was talking to a friend of mine today that has a Gen 2 RX-7. He said when his floods he pulls the fuel pump fuse cranks it a few times and then puts it back in and then he is able to start the car. Will this work for us with the new 8's?

Nat

just a little FYI: when i test drove the 8, the dealer took it from the parking spot and pulled it by the sidewalk (about 25ft away) and turned it off. i thought it was going to be flooded, so i jumped in and started up the car fine...hmmm, not flooded...

so, i wondered how overexaggerated this flooding issue has been...i let off the clutch a bit, and then stalled purpose...said "whoops!", my salesperson said "that's alright, let's start her again." fired up once more, no problems yet. i put the car in gear again and let off the clutch and at the friction point, faked a sneezed and stalled her again. without hesitation, i turned the key and she fired up again. i had enough stalling and was about to proceed with the test drive when i stalled for the 3rd time (unintentional) and said "i'm really sorry". my sales rep said, "you didn't do anything wrong, just start her up again. and whaddya know...she fired right up.

the car had been started 4 times within 5 mins and fired up each time without a hiccup...i honestly think this flooding this has been blown way out of proportion...or it could've been that particular car...

my advice is if you're concerned about flooding...stall the car a few times in the sales lot...i did!

Your expensive car is a piece of crap for the following reasons:
X. It's expensive
Y. It's unreliable
Z. It attracts people like you to it


X. No it isn't. Especially compared to the other cars in it's class. Mine was 3k more than my Explorer Sport Trac. 5k more than my LS Miata. That isn't expensive.

Y. Mine isn't. I don't think there is enough evidence to support this. Yeah some poeple on this board have problems. Most don't. (Same with all cars).

Z. Fine by me. Tell me what you drive so I know how to avoid people like you.

Originally posted by JaegerNH
Way to go Sherlock Holmes! Considering most of my postings stated clearly that I had not bought one because of mpg and flooding problems in the first line, you're quite perceptive. Wow, and I thought the whole thing about guys using a car to compensate for shortcomings in other areas was just an urban legend.

Congratulations on your 12mpg. I'm sure all your friends are quite impressed at your gas purchasing prowess. You da man!
Your next car might be a Testarossa? Errrr... sure dude whatever you say. Maybe you can pick me and my girlfriend up in it. Perhaps you know her, she's currently the reigning Miss America.

Your expensive car is a piece of crap for the following reasons:
X. It's expensive
Y. It's unreliable
Z. It attracts people like you to it

It is not that expensive. It's not unreliable. The gas mileage has to do mostly with people driving these cars like lunatics. I get 18-24 mpg just like the sticker says..... unless I wind out the engine ALL THE TIME. This is what is being done by the people bitching about mileage.

JUST GO AWAY !!!

I have an automatic and it has flooded once by my husband who did not believe it could happen....I got great service by Mazda Roadside assistance also. I don't have very good gas mileage and I DON"T drive the car like a lunatic at all.....pretty mild actually and once and awhile I have some fun. MPG is an issue. I am a rookie rotary and I bought the car knowing it's quirks and I love it that much that I am dealing with it. It is a great car that just needs a few quirks worked out...like many brand new cars/engines(Renesis rotary not previous rotaries). I wish the gas mileage was better...avg 12-14mpg.

My MPG has already increased to 16-18 MPG at 600 miles. Big jump. I might see improvement if I stop jumping if off the line when the light hits green though :)

Originally posted by KrustyKlown
My MPG has already increased to 16-18 MPG at 600 miles. Big jump. I might see improvement if I stop jumping if off the line when the light hits green though :)


Hehe. You just proved my point.;)

I suspect the L flash will help the flood issue. I have had all three gen RX-7s and this 8. None of my cars flooded. The only problem I have with flood issues is 86-88 RX-7s that I bought for my dealership. they were all high mile cars that were abused. I ran a couple tanks of Cheveron premium fuel through them and never had a problem after that. BTW all of my RX7s and 8s have used premium fuel with frequent oil changes. I personaly have driven almost 1 million miles on rotaries with no engine failures. I wish I could say the same about piston engines I have driven and flown.
I hope they continue building this engine and look foward to seeing them certified for aircraft.

Mazda does provide Roadside assistance with every U.S. car sold.

John

Originally posted by Arcane

the car had been started 4 times within 5 mins and fired up each time without a hiccup...i honestly think this flooding this has been blown way out of proportion...or it could've been that particular car

Just another data point - I spent a week shutting down cold and stalling the car out and did not get it to flood. So you aren't guaranteed to flood just because you stall the car. I agree that the issue has been blown out of proportion, however it definately does affect some people. I think the car is more likely to exhibit the issue if it's stopped cold and then let sit for a little while...

Originally posted by BillK
Regardless of what you say and who is or isn't trolling, point is that Mazda will need to do something about the flooding problem or the 8 is likely to be both the rebirth of and the last gasp of the rotary.

Those of us who are rotary enthusiasts understand the nature of the engine, but point is is that the driver who just wants a sports car won't stand for it, nor will the person who just wants a cool, sporty car.

It of course has long been a foregone conclusion that the 8 would appeal to rotary fans, but to be a long term commercial success it has to tantalize the everyday car buyer as well...

BillK is absolutely right. I love driving my RX-8, and I even get acceptable mileage (20 MPG average), but my 8 flooded earlier this week despite NEVER having been shut down cold. The last trip before it flooded was a 5 mile jaunt to a restaurant followed by a 8 mile scenic route home. 2 mornings later, flooded.

I have no problem with taking reasonable precautions such as not shutting the car down ice cold, not backing it out of the driveway and shutting it off, or even letting it run for at least 5 minutes, but if the car can flood EVEN IF those precautions are taken it's a serious cause for concern. Like I said before, I love the driving experience of the 8 and am a fan of the rotary engine, but there are many quality car choices out there that don't come with nearly as much negative baggage.

Between the flooding, the horsepower issues and the disappointing mileage, Mazda has a lot to make up for.

Originally posted by Arcane

so, i wondered how overexaggerated this flooding issue has been...i let off the clutch a bit, and then stalled purpose...said "whoops!", my salesperson said "that's alright, let's start her again." fired up once more, no problems yet. i put the car in gear again and let off the clutch and at the friction point, faked a sneezed and stalled her again. without hesitation, i turned the key and she fired up again. i had enough stalling and was about to proceed with the test drive when i stalled for the 3rd time (unintentional) and said "i'm really sorry". my sales rep said, "you didn't do anything wrong, just start her up again. and whaddya know...she fired right up.

the car had been started 4 times within 5 mins and fired up each time without a hiccup...i honestly think this flooding this has been blown way out of proportion...or it could've been that particular car...

my advice is if you're concerned about flooding...stall the car a few times in the sales lot...i did!

You see no one gives this buddy a lecture for trying to flood the car but when I did what he did I got it from you folks.

Remeber this link folks!

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?threadid=21155&perpage=15&highlight=whitegts&pagenumber=1

Arcane you must be a special person because you got off easy. Not me!

Originally posted by JaegerNH
I should delete the bookmark to this site, ...

Please, by all means, do!

Yah, it worked for me. I tried the mazda manual way, pressing the gas pedal down, and it wouldnt work, then my brother (who has a FD3s) told me to just take out the fuse for the fuel pump. Voila. Worked, well I also had to jump the car in the process, beacuse of the unsuccessful cranking killed the battery.

edit: i forgot to mention i am finally getting a coinsistent 19MPG. As long as you dont drive like an idiot, the MPG should be ok.

Originally posted by Hou-TX-RX-8
I was talking to a friend of mine today that has a Gen 2 RX-7. He said when his floods he pulls the fuel pump fuse cranks it a few times and then puts it back in and then he is able to start the car. Will this work for us with the new 8's?

Nat

Originally posted by White_GTS
You see no one gives this buddy a lecture for trying to flood the car but when I did what he did I got it from you folks.

Remeber this link folks!

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?threadid=21155&perpage=15&highlight=whitegts&pagenumber=1

Arcane you must be a special person because you got off easy. Not me! maybe nobody has caught it yet. doesn't matter if they do, because i won't reply back with negative comments. i think people attacked you because you threw some light insults their way. or it could be the fact that you stalled it intentionally to flood it whereas, i stalled it to prove it won't flood. or some people like to be mean on the internet because it's a safe place to do it in, typically speaking.

either way, everyone can verbally attack me for what i did...i don't care, the best response they'll get out of me is an "ok" or "cool"

You probably don't delete this bookmark because Altimas are boring to own and drive. My rx8 has never flooded and I too have turned it off for 10 seconds and restarted it with no problem. You must be jealous.

Roaddemon:

If it takes driving a boring car to avoid being stranded in my driveway when I need to be somewhere, I can live with that.
Boring works.

If the car did not have the problems that have been explored here ad nauseum, my guess is they'd be flying off the lot and you would have something I desired but couldn't have without a long wait or high markup. Then perhaps you could accuse me of being jealous.

At this point I feel quite smart for not jumping in. If you want to pay for the privilege of field testing their product for them, you're obviously a true fan and I'm sure they appreciate it.

Why is everyone getting so upset at what Jaeger says? It's his opinion that the 8 is no good, so he doesnt buy it. Only reason he will respond again and again is because people insult him and egg him on.

To be honest I was actually afraid that I may get stranded out somewhere if for some reason my car flooded and wouldnt turn back on. Now I make sure the engine is warm before I shut it off, never had to worry about that with my corolla. now that was an awesome car, 30 mpg!! But it aint no 8:-D

The weather is getting nicer, just enjoy it :-D

Look people this is 2004. No new car should flood. We had a 1983 RX-7, never flooded. I don't understand why these cars are prone to such a problem. and yes it is a problem. My sisters RX-7 sat in the garage for months on end whike she was living in Spain. I would take it out every now and then just to drive it and not let it sit for too long. At times I would just back it out of the garage, wash it and drive it back in. It always started. don't make excuses for the car, you shouldn't have to educate anyone on how to drive your car. If you need to move your car out of the way, you shouldn't have to let it run for any period of time before you shut it off. I've been waiting for Mazda to come out with a new RX. This is not what I expected.

Amen 911SC. A car is a car, not a toy. I wanted to like the car. I should have known that when it took almost a half a tank of gas to get from the dealership to my apartment the day i bought my car (all highway and taken very easily) that something was not right. I figured they didnt fill it up all the way. Education is not the answer, fixing the problem is.

I have now been forced by the Mazda dealership to flood the car over and over in order to get rid of my 8 using the lemon laws instead of compromising. The service manager there didnt even know about the TSB. We will be ready for flood #3 once the car is towed back to my dad's shop. With any luck, I will be rotary free in a few weeks. I took the plate off and got the insurance as minimum as possible. I will not be forced to pray to the rotary gods each time I get in the car for it to start. In effect, I am sacrificing my car to them.

Eric

Rieskame
The real posts do not support your comments. I've never had any of the problems you suggest. Why would anyone buy a 238 hp rx8 and expect 30mpg like a 110-120hp econobox. Your full of it. For whatever reasons,sounds like your forcing a lemon law on your car.

Real posts? WTF does that mean?

rieskame - my guess is when it comes to the lemon law stage some regional manager is involved. For dramatic effect, let him get in the car and step by step instruct him how to flood it at will (if he doesn't know already). I'm really surprised more people haven't used the lemon law at this point.

I owned an 80 RX7 from 1979 to 1984 and I never experienced the flooding phenomena. It was moved and valeted with no problems. The car also had the pull choke that automatically popped back when the car warmed up. Is the flooding an RX8 problem that was not there for the RX7s? Did anyone experience it with later generations of the RX7?

Real post means Posts that are credible. Yours do not make sense. You two have lemonbrain. Do I smell troll?

Plenty of "real" and credible posters have experienced flooding problems and/or terrible mileage (13 MPG).

The mileage is at least easily explained... short trips, long idle times, and stop n go traffic all have huge negative impacts on mileage. The flooding is a far more significant problem and does not seem to be limited to people who shut the car down ice cold.

alamike - I've had 5 RX-7s, 81-88. My 88 flooded once after I stalled it when it was below zero here in Chicago. That's it. Rotaries are known to occassionally flood.

I couldn't care less about the flooding, mileage, and other overblown hysteria I've seen on this board. I can't wait to have another rotary car. This Altima-like box that I'm driving now just doesn't put the big grin on my face that my RX's did.

JaegerNH - I can see your point being someone who has never owned a rotary. You don't get it. If you did own one, then you'd understand why so many people don't have a problem with 15 mpg and look for an excuse to take the long route every chance they get. There simply is nothing like it. Give the RX-8 a try. You'll be converted. Otherwise,

http://www.nissantalk.com/forum/

Paulie - just to set the record straight, I owned a 1987 RX-7 and drove it happily for 12 years. During that time I flooded it about 3 times. The first 2 times I simply let it sit and it later cranked over. By the 3rd time I knew to remove the fuel inj fuse, crank it to clear the gas then put it back and try again. The point being I was never stranded, just delayed. What I'm seeing on this board is people who have flooded 3 times in 9 months requiring a tow to the nearest dealership. That's a huge difference.

I agree, there are quite a few people that are not having any problems with their car and don't mind the low fuel economy. But to have these people diminish the concerns of those that are having a miserable experience so far is disappointing.

My car was flashed in December before I bought it. Maybe that explains why I have had no flooding problems. I think flooding is an old issue. The reflash seems to take care of it. Otherwise this car is close to perfect. I also had two 1st generation rx7s. Both were great cars. Never flooded them or even Knew about rx7 flooding problems (that was before forums like this). You guys are making a big deal about nothing. I'm sure there are lemons out there. I sure don't have one.
Fuel economy is the same as my EX 626 2.5 six cylinder. WITH 70HP MORE TO BOOT. I could'nt be happier.
Why do people complain, here, who have no real issues or do not even own an 8? That's not what this forum is for (IMO). You know who you are. Trolls.

IMHO,
Most of the people (not saying that there were many) that towed their car to the dealer did it for 2 reasons.
1)They did not know how to un-flood the car (pull the pump fuse or do the throttle to the floor thing)
or
2)They tried the re-start procedure but the battery was weak.

I believe for one thing that the stock battery is a little on the weak side , esp when cold.
I will probably get a "Good" battery some time in the future.

I don't think the RX8 floods any more than any of the RX7s.
People blow this way out of proportion.

The first time it flooded i had to pull the fuel pump fuse and connect the battery to a charger to get it unflooded. That procedure works, but isnt feasible if you are anywhere but home. I drive 90% highway and was getting 15mpg constantly.

JaegerNH - then you should know exactly what I'm talking about. RX's can be a love/hate deal. I said after I owned my first one, I'd never buy another. I've owned 5 and will own more.

All of you people who hate your 8, gave it back, etc., will eventually get used to it and/or get another one sometime down the road. It's in your blood. The fact that you are still on this board proves my point.

What I'm seeing on this board is people who have flooded 3 times in 9 months requiring a tow to the nearest dealership. That's a huge difference.

The difference is you know how to recover a flooded rotary. First time rotary owners don't and have no choice but to get a tow. Why are you concerned if you know how to? And also, what MPG did you get with yours? Let me guess. 20-22 MPG unless you drove it like a race car and then you got 13-15. Sound familiar?

So, JaegerNH, when are you getting yours? You can keep trying to convince yourself that you don't want one by bringing up all of the issues but you know as well as I do that you will get one.

I'm concerned that recovering from a flooded engine with the 8 has more to it than the 7. See the Mazda service bulletin about what the techs are told to do at http://www.finishlineperformance.com/rx8/docs/01-011-04.htm

With my RX-7, I routinely got around 25 MPG with mostly highway driving. I'd still consider getting an RX-8, once I get some indication that they have a handle on the problems and ways to correct them. Whether that's 2005, 2006, or 2007 I'm not sure.

I don't understand why someone who had an RX7 for so long (and hates the RX8) isn't on the RX7 boards instead of here, where we love the RX8.

I didn't buy an RX8 and then hang out on the Altima web boards.

Why do the moderators let such BS through? Sure JaegerNH seems to be more reasonable now but his original post in this thread was retarded. Obvious trolling, no benefit to the community, and basically just being a useless whiner.

I mean, really: the guy is useless. Ban his sorry ass account. There are people here who actually bought an RX8 or even returned an RX8 (abusing lemon laws or whatever) and I'll respect those people for their opinions, but anyone stupid enough to join a web board dedicated to a car that he's declared he'd never buy is not someone worthy of any kind of respect.

Yes, the flooding issue is an issue, and it's not an issue like Janet Jackson's nipple (all show, no substance) it's a substantive issue, but that shouldn't mean we have to put up with such inanity! Instead it should mean we can sit down and discuss different ways of dealing with the issue.

It's like Marla in Fight Club showing up to the testicular cancer support group.

There, I've done my rant for now. You'd think it was Monday morning or something.