Hi, im new to this board.. .. :)..


Im about to trade my audi in for a new car.. Considering Rx8 or 350Z..

How you guys like your rx8? I would really love to get an rx8 (since i already own rx7) and i like the looks of 8 better than Z.

But i heard few horror stories about rx8.. heat problems, engine problems and such...

Please give me your honest opinion on ur ride...


thank you so much.

I've had my RX-8 for 2 months and 2,000 miles, and no problems whatsoever so far. Only con I see is the 15 mpg I've been getting. Some say the gas mileage gets better as more miles are put on the car...
I considered the 350Z as well, but in the end there really wasn't any contest in my mind - with the 8 you get a useable back seat, a unique butter-smooth engine, a beatiful interior, and a relatively rare automobile. Unless you can afford the convertible roadster and have no use for a back seat or storage space, I'd definitely go with the 8.

that is why i want rx8.. back seats, and high reving ROTARY ;).

but then i hear all these crazy rumors about engine blowining, bla bla bla.... scares me to get ione.

Engine blowing ??? I have been on this forum for a few months, and I don;t read every post, but I can't remember reading about blowing engines. Its under warranty anyway, so who cares ?

I love my 8. Not only does it look way better than the 350z, but will outhandle it easily.

Well, I think there's been like 6 people with blown engines - with a brand new car model with a brand new engine, I don't know that that's such a big #. Of course Mazda replaced all the blown engines, and any problems you may have during warranty would be covered.
With a forum such as this, one has to realize that people that have had problems are going to be vocal about it, and these comments are the ones that are going to stand out - the vast vast majority of people on this forum have not had problems with their cars. The fact is, you usually just don't hear about problems people have with their cars because they're not posted on forums, or you don't visit the forums for a car you're not interested in...personally, I wouldn't (and didn't) worry about scattered anecdotal reports of mechanical problems.

Originally posted by markfw
I love my 8. Not only does it look way better than the 350z, but will outhandle it easily.

I guess i'll chime in here about the Z...

I love my Z. Not only does it look way better than the RX-8, but will out accellerate it easily. :D

Originally posted by zthang
I guess i'll chime in here about the Z...

I love my Z. Not only does it look way better than the RX-8, but will out accellerate it easily. :D

Its hard to resist when someone says something negative about your own property...::p

Have a look at this thread, it'll give you a good idea of how the majority of RX-8 owners love their cars:

The Little Things (http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9437)

Sure, there have been some instances of lost engines but not because they "blew up". A sign of engine failure has something to do with a coolant leak. I don't know the exact detail as to the issue, please do a search and get that information. This has not by any means been a gigantic problem but it has effected some cars, maybe 50-100 out of all the 8's on the road. Your going to hear problems more readily as a form of information exchange on this board, but the issue is not an endemic problem with this car.

Now, if you want more raw power and straight line performance, go with the Zed...

If you want the rotary, four doors, four seats, new styling and a car that can hold it's own on an autox course, go with the 8..

fstfd3spower,

I was in the same position as you are. Actually I went to buy a Z and found out I couldn't get one in brickyard red...and I was driving past a mazda dealership and thought...hmmmm. So I stopped and now I own an RX. I have driven both and still do often drive the Z (my best friend has one and we trade out on occassion.) IMO the Z is faster up to about 60ish and then it evens out with the 8 (me and my friend testing out our cars). The 8 rides and handles better. The Z is rather abusive to the driver when driving for longer periods. I like the lines and looks of both cars. I mean seriously people...they are both great looking and fast. They both stand out in any parking lot. I love my 8 but I would never knock the Z. Of course the back seats were also nice for my two toddlers to ride in. Just my thoughts.

J

if you looking for good looking and performance then go for z but if you looking for more room, good looking, smoothness, rareness (i don't see many rx-8 yet on the street) and girls ^^ (i saw a lot of girls looking at rx-8 when i was test driving one) then rx-8 is better.

this is my opinion ^^

i'm in the same boat...looking at both the Z and the 8. test drove both the other day. i drove the Z first. Its aggressive lines and straight line power almost sold me, but a little nagging voice inside my head (sounded strangely like my fiance) told me to check out the 8 before doing something i regretted.

i'm not knocking on the Z because it's an incredible car, which does what it sets out to do very well, but once i drove the 8, there was no question in my mind which car i would see myself loving 5 years down the road just as much as the day i bought it.

the interior of the 8 blew away the Z's and the 8 is much more fun (and comfortable) to drive around a busy city (Dallas). i have to admit that the straight line acceleration wasn't as much fun as when i laid the pedal to the metal in the Z, but as soon as i reached third or had to turn the steering wheel, the 8 had me sold.

as soon as i graduate from law school in may, i'm laying the trusty corolla to rest and getting a black 8. i wonder if that'll be a distraction from studying for the bar....

Z wears you out when you drive. Nothing is a hard core as my Integra DC 2 Type R before this one. The Z roadster is better. Just add Brembo and a few mods that is

P.S. buy the track ver. ie. with Brembo and sports suspension - I driven both - the touring version is a bad ride. You will be scared by the engine - 206kW with less suspension made me very nervous.

I am still happy with my 8 = it is just a classier and better looking car IMO

Originally posted by markfw
Engine blowing ??? I have been on this forum for a few months, and I don;t read every post, but I can't remember reading about blowing engines. Its under warranty anyway, so who cares ?

I love my 8. Not only does it look way better than the 350z, but will outhandle it easily.

There have been some ( mine for instance) that blew engines.
But then there were quite a few 350Z's with blown engines too.

And now Nissan has recalled ALL their cars with that 6 cylinder engine, 350X, G35, Maxima, trucks, you name it.

Internal sensor failure in the engine can cause fires.

They are swapping out the engines, but I hear they then rebuild them and put them back into the pool for exchanges.

Can you imagine getting somebodies ratted out engine with 50,000 miles to replace the engine from your car with only 5,000 on it?

Shocking!

I had my 8 since september. I have exactly 6000 mile on it now. The only problem I had was my rear left brake was squeeking and I took it in to have it fix. No problem with it anymore. My brother has a black 350z and it is a very great looking care. In fact I had my heart set on getting a 350z ever since I found out that Nissan was bring it back. When it first came out. I went to test drive the car but the Nissan guys wouldn't let me drive it unless I was going to buy it. Man I was so disappointed. So, I decided to check out the evo 8. It was the same with those guys. I always had the 8 in the back of my mine, so when it came out I went to check it out. I wasn't expecting to test drive the car, I just wanted to see it up close. When I got to Westcot Mazda and saw the car in person. I was really impress with it. I love the interior of the car much better than the z and evo. The styling was better than the z and way better than the evo. And to my surprise, the saleman aske me if I want to test drive the car. I was really stunn and very excited. Of cours I said "Yes!" First the 8 ride was smoth and it corner effortlessly compare to my Mazda protege 5 which I had at the time. And I often autoX with the p5.It was fast but kinda sniky fast. Befor u know it your doing 90mph. And the back seat were just as spacious as my p5 wagon. I later drove my brother z. The is faster off the line than my 8 the steering needed more force to turn it. It wasn't as smoth as the 8. The ride was choppier in the Z, it kinda reminded me of my old 240sx. Which was severly moded. I couldn't live with that bouncing on a daily basis. As far as attention goes, the 8 get alot more looks. The 8 is the second Mazda I have own in the last 3 years and I am very satisfied with it.

Originally posted by RX8-TX
Its hard to resist when someone says something negative about your own property...::p

Very true...its hard to let opinionated comments slide. I probably shouldnt have been so sarcastic. Anyways, I'm just going to have to give up on this thread just like most other threads that include the Z. There are just too many comments to reply to. My advice to you...get the RX-8. You obviously came to this board b/c youre more interested in it. I just think you needed the motivation and support of other 8 owners. If you had asked the same question on the Z board, everyone would be telling you to get the Z, but for totally different reasons. Good luck deciding.

Originally posted by canzoomer
There have been some ( mine for instance) that blew engines.
But then there were quite a few 350Z's with blown engines too.

And now Nissan has recalled ALL their cars with that 6 cylinder engine, 350X, G35, Maxima, trucks, you name it.

Internal sensor failure in the engine can cause fires.

They are swapping out the engines, but I hear they then rebuild them and put them back into the pool for exchanges.

Can you imagine getting somebodies ratted out engine with 50,000 miles to replace the engine from your car with only 5,000 on it?

Shocking!

I've not heard of any 350Zs w/light or no mods requiring any engine replacements (the guy running insane amounts of NOS (>300 shot) on stock internals doesn't count). I've seen VERY few people on maxima.org that ever needed replacements of the 3.5L VQ engine (I can only think of one).

I've counted 8 unique RX-8 owners on this board so far who've needed engine replacements. Six are in the US. That's a little troubling considering there have been 10,267 RX-8s sold in the US vs. 47,857 350Zs.

As for Nissan recalls, it's the crankshaft position sensor. As for fires, that's a bunch of BS. I don't know where you got your info from. The result is not a fire. See http://www.cars.com/news/stories/103103_storyb_cc.jhtml?page=newsstory&aff=national and http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/recalls/recallresults.cfm?start=1&SearchType=DrillDown&type=VEHICLE&year=2002&make=NISSAN&model=MAXIMA&component_id=127&summary=true&PrintVersion=YES . BTW, it does NOT affect all cars w/the 3.5L VQ V6. Notice only 171 Zs are affected. I spoke to my dealer about the recall since my 02 Maxima might be affected and they mention only certain VINs are affected, not all.

Who you are referring to about swapping out engines and putting them in a pool for exchanges? Nissan or Mazda?

Back to the original thread, I have an 04 350Z (in addition to the Max) and I'll chime in. I'm not a fan of the RX-8's styling (two extra doors look funny) but I will say that the 8 is more practical and the 8 interior is hands down better than than Z.

I'm sure most people on here will say get the 8, and on the Z boards, people will tell you to get a Z.

The recall affects ALL 350Z sold, worldwide.
Not to mention all Infiniti and Nissan car with that engine.

Hmm, let's see some more facts:
http://uk.biz.yahoo.com/031031/241/ecqu4.html

" issan is to recall 2.5 million vehicles worldwide.

Nissan [NSANY] has announced that it has committed Y15-16 billion ($136-146 million) this year to cover the cost of recalling 2.56 million cars sold in Japan and abroad "

Edmunds:
"Major Nissan Recall Affects 700,000 U.S. Cars
Date Posted 11-06-2003

The second-largest recall in Japanese history affects more than 2.5 million Nissan vehicles, the company said last week. [B]Nissan says the recall affects about 700,000 vehicles sold in North America, including the 350Z coupe and roadster and the Altima sedan. The recall was spurred by complaints that a defective sensor in the engine could cause a short circuit and lead to the engine stopping. The affected vehicles were built from 1998 to 2003."

The actual recall wording:
Recall Alert: INFINITI G35, INFINITI I35, INFINITI M45, INFINITI Q45, NISSAN 350Z, NISSAN ALTIMA, NISSAN MAXIMA, NISSAN SENTRA
Owner Notification Date: Dec 02, 2003
Number of Units Potentially Affected: 630000
Component Description: ENGINE AND ENGINE COOLING
NHTSA Campaign Number: 03V455000 Schedule an Appointment
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Description of Recall Campaign: ON CERTAIN PASSENGER VEHICLES, THE CIRCUIT BOARD FOR THE CRANK POSITION SENSOR MAY HAVE AN IMPROPER SOLDER JOINT DUE TO SOLDER DEFORMATION CAUSED BY HEAT STRESS ACCELERATED BY THE EXISTENCE OF FLUX RESIDUE DURING THE SOLDERING PROCESS.
THIS COULD CAUSE THE "SERVICE ENGINE SOON" WARNING LIGHT TO COME ON, CREATE A NO START CONDITION, CAUSE REDUCED ENGINE POWER, OR CAUSE THE ENGINE TO STOP RUNNING WITHOUT WARNING DURING VEHICLE OPERATION, WHICH COULD RESULT IN A CRASH.

DEALERS WILL REPLACE THE CRANK POSITION SENSORS. VEHICLES INVOLVED IN A PREVIOUS RECALL CAMPAIGN, 01V357, ARE ALSO INCLUDED IN THIS NEW CAMPAIGN. THE REPLACEMENT SENSORS USED IN THAT CAMPAIGN ARE ALSO AFFECTED. OWNER NOTIFICATION IS EXPECTED TO BEGIN DURING DECEMBER 2003. OWNERS SHOULD CONTACT NISSAN AT 1-800-647-7261 OR INFINITI AT 1-800-662-6200.

The crank position sensor is internal to the engine.
NOT an hours job.
It is also the SECOND attempt to fix this same problem!

Originally posted by canzoomer
The recall affects ALL 350Z sold, worldwide.
Not to mention all Infiniti and Nissan car with that engine.


It is also the SECOND attempt to fix this same problem!

No, according to http://www.cars.com/news/stories/103103_storyb_cc.jhtml?page=newsstory&aff=national it only affects 171 350Zs. It's the same recall. Yes, I know about the 2.5 million figure, I read the many stories on it. Also, if it affected ALL 350Zs, wouldn't the 2004 350Z be affected? If so, how come no 2004 Nissans come up at http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/recalls/recallsearch.cfm ?


As for second attempt, yes, on certain cars. There was no prior recall for 02+ Maximas on the crankshaft position sensor nor any prior recall on 350Zs.

Well, there's no recalls at all on the 8 so far.....

:)

I need to throw my .02 in on this one as I traded in my 02 Maxima for my 8 and I also tested a 350z for a while before I made my decision. First about the recalls, there were I believe 5 total on the Maxima alone. I never had any problems with my Max that wasn't caused by my mods. (Greddy SP Exhaust, Warpspeed Y-pipes, Underdrive pulley, Injen CAI). In the 350 I didn't like the 2 seats or the interior. Oh fyi my 350 tester was a track model so no sunroof but it had the Brembros and the light wheels. I didn't like the looks compared to the 8 and with performance, while the Z car has more hp I didn't notice the difference with the 8. And as a maxima owner I can tell you the horsepower is not as rated on the maxima. The owners were attempting to get their money back do to false ads stating that hp was 255 or 265 when dynos were showing 215-220. There was a suit on -going with that and also with Nissan do to the paint chipping off the nose of the car when it was brand new. So Nissan has their problems just like Mazda. Back to the Z car, I didn't like the feel of the car to me. I previously owned a 93 300ZX TT and loved that car but this one just didn't work for me.

my suggestion... figure out what's most important to you and give both cars a test drive.

one of my friends has been gushing about getting a 350z for a while now and has had his mind dead set on getting one. he was EXTREMELY excited recently as he was going to make the trip to the dealer. the next day, i saw him very upset. why? he had test driven the Z and said he was disappointed. he didn't like the handling at all and said it didn't feel like 287hp. he wants to try driving my 8 next. i'm not sure how he'll like it, but the point is just start test driving different cars and i'm sure once you figure out what aspects of a car are important to you the choice will be clear.

Originally posted by Bigcat44
I need to throw my .02 in on this one as I traded in my 02 Maxima for my 8 and I also tested a 350z for a while before I made my decision. First about the recalls, there were I believe 5 total on the Maxima alone. I never had any problems with my Max that wasn't caused by my mods. (Greddy SP Exhaust, Warpspeed Y-pipes, Underdrive pulley, Injen CAI). In the 350 I didn't like the 2 seats or the interior. Oh fyi my 350 tester was a track model so no sunroof but it had the Brembros and the light wheels. I didn't like the looks compared to the 8 and with performance, while the Z car has more hp I didn't notice the difference with the 8. And as a maxima owner I can tell you the horsepower is not as rated on the maxima. The owners were attempting to get their money back do to false ads stating that hp was 255 or 265 when dynos were showing 215-220. There was a suit on -going with that and also with Nissan do to the paint chipping off the nose of the car when it was brand new. So Nissan has their problems just like Mazda. Back to the Z car, I didn't like the feel of the car to me. I previously owned a 93 300ZX TT and loved that car but this one just didn't work for me.


17% drivetrain lose being common that's a really dumb attempted lawsuit.

I think Voodoo summed it up rather well as to which car is best for you. However some people will lead you to believe the 350Z is some straightline drag car that can't handle. It handles rather well but not quite as well as the 8. The Z will out accelerate the 8 and it should be noticable to most people, even though some have reported them feeling similar. They're different cars and it all depends on what you're looking for in a car.

Yeah I think that maybe I was expecting more accel feel and didn't feel it though I will say this. I loved the VQ engine as it was very easy to work on and mod and the one thing I don't like about my 8 being a meck-a-neck by trade is that I don't understand the concept of the rotary and might not be able to fix it if something were to go wrong! I also am really wanting to test drive an STi and an Evo since our last (bashing) though I see you are fighting the same fight with others concerning the s2000 v 8 thread! :D

some of you guys are funny.

I have driven an S2000, 350Z Track Model, and an RX8 6spd with GT package.

If you cannot see the difference in power delivery and speed between the S2K, 350Z and Rx8, you should not be driving.

the S2K and Rx8 are closer in power and straigh line feel, mainly due to their high RPM low toruq motors.

the Z is almost the exact opposite...it has tons of low end torque and its RPM is more normal.

The S2K and RX8 are like Exacto knives, they are delicate and both very sharp (with the S2K being the sharpest but also requiring lots of concentration). the Z is like a very fine Swiss Army knife. Its a little larger, feels more robust and will do what the Exacto knife does, but in a different way.

I could see myself driving a Z or RX8 every day, I can't say the same for an S2K (dailt driver with 20 mile commute).

I've been looking at both the RX8 and Z for some time now and its a toss up every time I go back to the pro's/cons. However more and more the 8 seems to have teething problems that just don't appeal to me.

In any case, both cars a sports car and they bring different feelings to the table.

Ciccone

Originally posted by ciccone376
some of you guys are funny.

I have driven an S2000, 350Z Track Model, and an RX8 6spd with GT package.

If you cannot see the difference in power delivery and speed between the S2K, 350Z and Rx8, you should not be driving.

the S2K and Rx8 are closer in power and straigh line feel, mainly due to their high RPM low toruq motors.

the Z is almost the exact opposite...it has tons of low end torque and its RPM is more normal.

The S2K and RX8 are like Exacto knives, they are delicate and both very sharp (with the S2K being the sharpest but also requiring lots of concentration). the Z is like a very fine Swiss Army knife. Its a little larger, feels more robust and will do what the Exacto knife does, but in a different way.

I could see myself driving a Z or RX8 every day, I can't say the same for an S2K (dailt driver with 20 mile commute).

I've been looking at both the RX8 and Z for some time now and its a toss up every time I go back to the pro's/cons. However more and more the 8 seems to have teething problems that just don't appeal to me.

In any case, both cars a sports car and they bring different feelings to the table.

Ciccone

Yeah you are right, you know nothing about me but can tell that I don't know what i am talking about becuase I don't notice a straightline difference in accel between a 8 and a Z you are so right only well you couldn't be so more inherently wrong. The advertised hp on a Z is 287 hmm so lets figure more of 260 if that compared to a 238 yeah I should have noticed the night and day difference??? Yeah right First I made it clear that it was my opinion that I didn't notice a difference and you are entitled to have a difference of opinion but that doesn't mean that you have the correct one. Get a clue first and then try and apply it to something thats in your realm of control :D

Originally posted by Bigcat44
Yeah you are right, you know nothing about me but can tell that I don't know what i am talking about becuase I don't notice a straightline difference in accel between a 8 and a Z you are so right only well you couldn't be so more inherently wrong. The advertised hp on a Z is 287 hmm so lets figure more of 260 if that compared to a 238 yeah I should have noticed the night and day difference??? Yeah right First I made it clear that it was my opinion that I didn't notice a difference and you are entitled to have a difference of opinion but that doesn't mean that you have the correct one. Get a clue first and then try and apply it to something thats in your realm of control :D
Cicc's post was pretty rational, and yours is pretty incoherent...

-john

My Mazda dealership is right next door to my nissan dealership and i mean they are sharing the same lot. the day i bought my rx-8 it was parked right in front of the building and there was a ton of women gocking over the car along with quiet a few guys checking out the goods. it was sort of funny because here i am inside the building looking out as a ton of folks were going nuts over my car and i look over at the Nissan lot and there is 3 z's parked in plain view and not one person went over to check them out. Personally i love both cars but i am a sucker for the 8's styling and not to mention i don't feel like i need to wear a kidney belt when i drive it.

Originally posted by jdmlover79
and girls ^^ (i saw a lot of girls looking at rx-8 when i was test driving one) then rx-8 is better.

this is my opinion ^^

hmmmm... after reading this...I think my girl should have gotten a Z :P

I dont mind the girls lookin at her ;)...but the boyz...no one looks at my babe

Originally posted by Butt Dyno
Cicc's post was pretty rational, and yours is pretty incoherent...

-john

as your is pretty irrelevant :o I never insulted any 350z owners nor did I say anything insulting to those that favor the Z car I simply said I did not feel a difference in power. Also explain to me your comment being "incoherent"?

Edmunds review says it all.

Edmunds review of Rx8 vs 350Z (http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/101039/page002.html)

IF you dont properly break-in the engine.... then it may cause some parts to mess up... if properly broken-in.. it WILL last LONG... i test drove it and ... its so quite...i drove the g35 as well... not the 350Z though ... but RX-8 is fast GO TO EDMUNDS THEY DID a review it will help you decide... rx-8 is better ...

Originally posted by renotse
Edmunds review says it all.

Edmunds review of Rx8 vs 350Z (http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/101039/page002.html)

Top Gear's Reivew in Sept 2003 says it all.
http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7993&perpage=15&pagenumber=1

Just showing how not every article written about any car is the absolute truth.

Originally posted by zthang
Top Gear's Reivew in Sept 2003 says it all.
http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7993&perpage=15&pagenumber=1

Just showing how not every article written about any car is the absolute truth.

Very true...everyone has different priorities. It's pointless to pick 'the better' car for anyone. So many things are involved that it's not even worth the time to make conjectures about it.

Ultimately its a very personal decission, where not only performance or looks are involved, but how the brand is perceived, etc...

I am going for a beer...later!

Originally posted by rx-7~rx-8
IF you dont properly break-in the engine.... then it may cause some parts to mess up... if properly broken-in.. it WILL last LONG... i test drove it and ... its so quite...i drove the g35 as well... not the 350Z though ... but RX-8 is fast GO TO EDMUNDS THEY DID a review it will help you decide... rx-8 is better ...


Well I'm convinced, I'm trading my WRX in tomorrow!

It's gotta be true! I saw it right here on the internet! Al Gore invented it and he wouldn't let it lie :)

Originally posted by Sea Ray
It's gotta be true! I saw it right here on the internet! Al Gore invented it and he wouldn't let it lie :)

Thank god for Al Gore, who knows what car I would be driving if it weren't for him! I'd also like the thank Al Sharpton for no reason!

Originally posted by RX8-TX
Very true...everyone has different priorities. It's pointless to pick 'the better' car for anyone. So many things are involved that it's not even worth the time to make conjectures about it.

Ultimately its a very personal decission, where not only performance or looks are involved, but how the brand is perceived, etc...

I am going for a beer...later!

Well put! It's good to see smart car owners even on the internet. If we ever meet, ill buy ya a beer.

Originally posted by fstfd3spower
that is why i want rx8.. back seats, and high reving ROTARY ;).

but then i hear all these crazy rumors about engine blowining, bla bla bla.... scares me to get ione.


For the car only being out for 5 months I find it had to belive that someone blew thier engine already......first off you have to break it in for at least 600 miles....even if you drove it off the lot redlining it you would have a damm hard time blowing the engine( it would run like crap in the future, but I don't think you would blow it). I guess it is possile to have a bad one but who cares it has a 48 month warrenty they would drop in a new engine or give you a new car.....

Talking the guy who sold me mine, he said they didn't even break in the demo model and that thing gets driven real hard!!!.....I know that for a fact :cool: . I just got mine but I have a friend who got his when they hit the lot in july. He drives like a freakin' maniac and he has had ZERO issues. But there was that one speeding ticket............

didn't like the Z but it does have great torque but doesn't handel that well and has a very harsh ride. If you want silky smooth excelleration and mind blowning handeling blunk down the dough for a 8. If you want that head slapping tourque and a ok ride get the Z.

Originally posted by fstfd3spower
that is why i want rx8.. back seats, and high reving ROTARY ;).

but then i hear all these crazy rumors about engine blowining, bla bla bla.... scares me to get ione.


For the car only being out for 5 months I find it had to belive that someone blew thier engine already......first off you have to break it in for at least 600 miles....even if you drove it off the lot redlining it you would have a damm hard time blowing the engine( it would run like crap in the future, but I don't think you would blow it). I guess it is possile to have a bad one but who cares it has a 48 month warrenty they would drop in a new engine or give you a new car.....

Talking the guy who sold me mine, he said they didn't even break in the demo model and that thing gets driven real hard!!!.....I know that for a fact :cool: . I just got mine but I have a friend who got his when they hit the lot in july. He drives like a freakin' maniac and he has had ZERO issues. But there was that one speeding ticket............

didn't like the Z but it does have great torque but doesn't handel that well and has a very harsh ride. If you want silky smooth excelleration and mind blowning handeling blunk down the dough for a 8. If you want that head slapping tourque and a ok ride get the Z.

Originally posted by Bigcat44
I need to throw my .02 in on this one as I traded in my 02 Maxima for my 8 and I also tested a 350z for a while before I made my decision. First about the recalls, there were I believe 5 total on the Maxima alone. I never had any problems with my Max that wasn't caused by my mods. ...

. The owners were attempting to get their money back do to false ads stating that hp was 255 or 265 when dynos were showing 215-220. There was a suit on -going with that and also with Nissan do to the paint chipping off the nose of the car when it was brand new. So Nissan has their problems just like Mazda. Back to the Z car, I didn't like the feel of the car to me. I previously owned a 93 300ZX TT and loved that car but this one just didn't work for me.

There are NOT 5 recalls on the 02 Maxima. There are up to 4 if you had a GLE (there was a small # of GLEs that had odometers that read in km instead of miles). If you had other trims, you could have up to 3. I just called Nissan North America, gave them my VIN, and they said my specific 02 Maxima GXE is NOT affected by the latest crankshift position sensor recall, so I've had 2 recalls so far. It is a bit annoying I admit since the 02 is the 3rd model year of that generation, whereas the 1st model year of that gen (2000) still has 0 recalls.

About the hp lawsuit, NO, that's not the issue. The issue is that Nissan claimed that the Maxima has 255 hp while the Altima has 240. There are claims that they produce the same amount of power at the wheels after driveline loss. I haven't seen the dyno charts of both as proof. I recall my stock 2K2 Max GXE auto dynoed at ~196 hp at the wheels (have to find printout), which is about right for automatic driveline losses. The 02+ Altima and 02-03 Max supposedly use the same automatiic transmission which takes another variable out.

Originally posted by joejoe
For the car only being out for 5 months I find it had to belive that someone blew thier engine already......first off you have to break it in for at least 600 miles....even if you drove it off the lot redlining it you would have a damm hard time blowing the engine( it would run like crap in the future, but I don't think you would blow it). I guess it is possile to have a bad one but who cares it has a 48 month warrenty they would drop in a new engine or give you a new car.....

Talking the guy who sold me mine, he said they didn't even break in the demo model and that thing gets driven real hard!!!.....I know that for a fact :cool: . I just got mine but I have a friend who got his when they hit the lot in july. He drives like a freakin' maniac and he has had ZERO issues. But there was that one speeding ticket............

didn't like the Z but it does have great torque but doesn't handel that well and has a very harsh ride. If you want silky smooth excelleration and mind blowning handeling blunk down the dough for a 8. If you want that head slapping tourque and a ok ride get the Z.

Find it hard to believe all you like, there's pretty good evidence that 50-100 engines have been replaced in North America already.

Originally posted by cwerdna
There are NOT 5 recalls on the 02 Maxima. There are up to 4 if you had a GLE (there was a small # of GLEs that had odometers that read in km instead of miles). If you had other trims, you could have up to 3. I just called Nissan North America, gave them my VIN, and they said my specific 02 Maxima GXE is NOT affected by the latest crankshift position sensor recall, so I've had 2 recalls so far. It is a bit annoying I admit since the 02 is the 3rd model year of that generation, whereas the 1st model year of that gen (2000) still has 0 recalls.

About the hp lawsuit, NO, that's not the issue. The issue is that Nissan claimed that the Maxima has 255 hp while the Altima has 240. There are claims that they produce the same amount of power at the wheels after driveline loss. I haven't seen the dyno charts of both as proof. I recall my stock 2K2 Max GXE auto dynoed at ~196 hp at the wheels (have to find printout), which is about right for automatic driveline losses. The 02+ Altima and 02-03 Max supposedly use the same automatiic transmission which takes another variable out.

Lets see you are incorrect when you say there are 4 total, my car had the crank sensor, headlights, MAFS, Ignition coils, Sunroof noise and I can keep going if you would like. I had an SE and the reason for the difference in recalls even though they are the same generation is because Nissan classifies it's generations off of body styles and not engines. They changed from the VQ30 to the VQ35DE in 2k2 and then as you could tell changed body styles but kept the engine for 2k4. As for the HP issue how does this differ from Mazda or for that matter Hyundai? Both Mazda and Hyundai dealt with their issues of reporting false numbers (though apparently Mazda had the correct numbers but had to de-tune?) and paid people or took the cars back. Nissan has yet to do this.

I have a 350z and i work at a mazda dealer.....so if you all want deals...let me know... i am pretty unbiased even though i have owned 4 z's before this one...the RX-8 is slow, ugly, back seat in a sports car..that really makes sence....and the mfg is buying them back by the truckloads because of false claims....my service guys hate the damn things..we are booked up for weeks fixing the things that we sold...as new....we sponser some auto cross events ..but end up fixing the damn things right after....trust me if you had to make a choice ...dump the RX-8 idea...Z all day...

my z gets hella more power....traction control sucks..but it is damn good in rain and slippery weather...more torque...roominess sucks...but its a sports car...has larger following...kits look better. more of them...better mods...tire issues but other than that....excellent car! mfg are not buying them back in droves like the mazda 8! over all the car stinks....ask out service techs.....they hate em!!! a car is a car to me..but the 8 is crap! sorry guys..just my opinion!

Originally posted by zthang
Well put! It's good to see smart car owners even on the internet. If we ever meet, ill buy ya a beer.

I like the bee....... I mean Z too !!!!! Can i have a beer too!?

No but seriously I will be the first to admit both are extrememly good looking and although the Z is almost as plentiful as the RSX now (In the LA area) theres just something about the Brickyard red that is just stunning.

I am totally happy with my 8. I am not at the current time satisfied with the power but thats why theres canzomers stage II and being able to handle .91g on the skidpad is very nice as well.

About the girls thing I tend to get lots of compliments from the asian persuasion a lot. I have a girfriend of nearly 6 years tho so there goes that benefit hehe. I cant complain shes gettin me my racing beat rear sway for christmas tho so im a happy camper.

I might get my GF a Z or G35 though then help her a little so that we can go to speed trials together she loves racing and if i can let her have fun with a awsome car that she can abuse as a daily driver responsibly then im all for it.

The RX8 is a car that you must respect. You must change your oil id say every 3k miles and you must warm up your car in the morning to ensure that you dont screw something up or end up flooded like some users on this board. So if you are on a fast paced schedule and dont make the time for warm ups oil changes etc then you should go for the Z definately.

For me however I wouldnt my car for anything at all its just that good.

Well, i test drove Rx8 yesterday.. Jst as i expected.. pretty much like rx7.. Awesome interior..Awesome handling... I really liked it.
best part of the car was the sound of rotary engine at 9000 rpm.. :) and backseats.. they are really comfty....

Downside was lowend hp... other than that, it was very very nice car...

Dealer was asking $35000 for that car though.. yes it had nevigation and factory body kit.. but damn.. $35000?? How much you guys paid for your rx8???

I think i will get rx8 instead of 350.

They're both excellent cars - the Z finished second in my case with the G35 coupe a distant third and the Crossfire two laps down.

If I forced myself to never look at the front end of the Z (shudder) and focused only on its qualities, I found it was too close to my '94 RX7 in terms of the physical packaging. I could transport a passenger, a loaf of bread and a couple of magazines andn that was about all. And I'd been struggling with that issue for a long time. Real world practicality creeps in there sooner or later.

As for performance, didja see that the UK show Top Gear ran both the Z and the 8 on the same track with the same driver, and they posted identical lap times? Good enough for me.

The 8 just spoke to me, which is incidentally why all the other manufacturers are still in business. Those brands, and the car models within them, "speak" to enough people globally every year that they're still around.

As a note, getting shrill about how your car is so great and someone else's is crap, you sort of betray your own lack of experience and a certain amount of immaturity.

Originally posted by OKINAWAN MAJIK
I have a 350z and i work at a mazda dealer.....so if you all want deals...let me know... i am pretty unbiased even though i have owned 4 z's before this one...the RX-8 is slow, ugly, back seat in a sports car..that really makes sence....and the mfg is buying them back by the truckloads because of false claims....my service guys hate the damn things..we are booked up for weeks fixing the things that we sold...as new....we sponser some auto cross events ..but end up fixing the damn things right after....trust me if you had to make a choice ...dump the RX-8 idea...Z all day...

my z gets hella more power....traction control sucks..but it is damn good in rain and slippery weather...more torque...roominess sucks...but its a sports car...has larger following...kits look better. more of them...better mods...tire issues but other than that....excellent car! mfg are not buying them back in droves like the mazda 8! over all the car stinks....ask out service techs.....they hate em!!! a car is a car to me..but the 8 is crap! sorry guys..just my opinion!

I totally agree, I heard lots of nitemare storys of servicing the RX8's and the issues they are having unless they drive like a woman in it

Since I was in the same boat, I though I'd chip in. I really liked the RX-8 (still occasionally cruising this forum to see how thing are going), and I tried twice to buy one but was burnt by greedy dealerships.

I decided to test a 350 to take it off my list. I didn't care for the rear styling and the fact that there was only 2 seats in such a large car. In the flesh however, the 350 looks much better than the pics. I actually like it as much as the RX-8 now. The interior is IMO, nicer without the RX-8's piano finish and that circular accent on the dash (no flames please, I'm just being honest). The ride however, was that best part. The dealer let me honk on the thing and man was I impressed! I realized that although the RX-8 met my expectations, the 350Z is what I was really looking for. The engine is so flexible and lots of torque. The exhaust sound is great and the MPG is surprisingly good as well (averaging over ~ 22MPG city/highway with frequent redlines). Body control is flat, and the brakes are great. Best of all, it was a car that I could enjoy without feeling the need to modify it (RX-8 would have needed sway bars, exhaust for sound, and some power enhancers). The 350Z does have its faults; the rear space in the hatch is ridiculous with that strut bar, and it's still a 3200+ lbs car with only 2 seats.

My point is that if you're wondering what car to get, you need to realize what it is you're looking for. The 350Z definitely feels and performs like a brutish sports car (the ride is not that bad, but I found the RX-8 too soft). The RX-8 is better in having more than 2 seats, more comfortable for cruising, easier for controlling at the limit, smoother engine, and definitely lighter in curb weight which can be felt while driving (although that doesn't necessarily equate to better performance). I would recommend that you try all kinds of cars (STI), think about it, and be truthful about the pros and cons. Unfortunatley, each car will have cons and it's simply a matter of weighing them. Who knows, you might surprise yourself and switch "camps". I did.

After 6 year with a 12 second FD RX-7, I purchased a Brickyard 350Z a few weeks ago to restore that emotion of driving I lost when I sold the RX-7 years ago. Only the 350Z is quieter, safer, more comfortable, easier to drive, and better on gas. Once again I'm volunteering to my wife to go to the corner store and buy a paper and take the long way home. :D

Hey Okinawan Majik,
Whats with the name? I only ask because I was there for 5 years so I wondered if you were still there and had the "hook up" on some things!

Originally posted by zthang
I guess i'll chime in here about the Z...

I love my Z. Not only does it look way better than the RX-8, but will out accellerate it easily. :D

Let me chime in here.

I love my 94 Rx-7. Not only does it look way better than the 350Z, but will out accellerate it, out brake it, out handle it, pull better skid pad #'s, Murder the 350Z on any track, much more fun to drive, 500 lbs lighter, better slalum numbers, Several catagories above the 350Z in the SCCA Handling rankings (actually the TOP catagory, SS). Oh yea and thats just in stock form, a modded one like mine makes even a bigger joke of the 350Z.

Originally posted by zerobanger
Let me chime in here.

I love my 94 Rx-7. Not only does it look way better than the 350Z, but will out accellerate it, out brake it, out handle it, pull better skid pad #'s, Murder the 350Z on any track, much funner to drive, better slalum numbers, Several catagories above the 350Z in the SCCA Handling rankings (actually the TOP catagory, SS). Oh yea and thats just in stock form, a modded one like mine makes even a bigger joke of the 350Z.

Until it goes KABOOOM! Your time will come as 80% of the other FD owners out there (myself included). I still kept the car and dealt with the issues, but be realistic about it's "advantages" eh.

Originally posted by 350z Driver
I totally agree, I heard lots of nitemare storys of servicing the RX8's and the issues they are having unless they drive like a woman in it

Yeah, what "nitemare storys" have you heard? I've been reading the posts on this board, and the complaints don't seem to be too bad. Stop making stuff up. Granted, it's going to be more difficult to service the 8 because most mechanics don't have experience with a rotary, so that's something to consider. It's not like you're not going to have difficulties buying the 350z either.

I looked hard at both cars and went with a Z Roadster.

The two big issues for me were -

1. back seat - I don't want one at all. Advantage Z

2. torque - 159 lb/ft for the rx8 is really weak imo. Advantage Z

Hey Okinawan Majik,

How about letting all of us know what Mazda dealer that you work for. I think everyone on this forum should know this so no one would bring their car to you for sevice since everyone there hates the RX8.

What a great attitude, maybe you should be working at the Nissan dealer instead? They will need all the help they can get when they start replacing cam sensors.

Originally posted by Bigcat44
Lets see you are incorrect when you say there are 4 total, my car had the crank sensor, headlights, MAFS, Ignition coils, Sunroof noise and I can keep going if you would like. I had an SE and the reason for the difference in recalls even though they are the same generation is because Nissan classifies it's generations off of body styles and not engines. They changed from the VQ30 to the VQ35DE in 2k2 and then as you could tell changed body styles but kept the engine for 2k4.

You talked about recalls, not other problems. There are NO recalls on the MAF, coils and sunroof. The crank sensor doesn't affect all 2K2s. Nissan told me that my particular VIN is unaffected. Go look at http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/recalls/recallsearch.cfm and look up the 2K2 Max. You'll see only 3 recalls: 1 for the accelerator stopper, 1 for tranvserse link, and 1 for the crankshaft position sensor.

The headlights issue isn't really a recall. It's pseudo-recall if you live in high HID theft areas (like NY and NJ) where they put on data dots and I think change the brackets. If you don't live in a high HID theft area, you don't get it.

How many recall notices did you get in the mail? I assert you received 3 (or 4 if you count the lights, but you don't live in a high HID theft area) at most.

Correct they changed engines in at the 2K2 model year. But, the one that affected a limited # of GLEs wasn't engine related, nor was the transverse link one.

Originally posted by FritzMan
Until it goes KABOOOM! Your time will come as 80% of the other FD owners out there (myself included). I still kept the car and dealt with the issues, but be realistic about it's "advantages" eh.

it went "KABOOOM", I paid the $6750 a few months ago to put a streetported engine, 3mm seals, replace motor mounts, hoses, pluges, etc.

When it goes "KABOOOM" again in a few years (or sooner), I will pay it again. I never said anything about reliability, but I will say my roommates 350Z which he baby's has had 3 ECU's, atleast 3 recalls, brake problems, tire problems, replaced shocks/struts and some other things with less than 7K miles on the car.

Cars are about compromise, if you cant afford to maintain an Rx-7 get a less sportscar like a 350Z.

Originally posted by zerobanger
sooner)but I will say my roommates 350Z which he baby's has had 3 ECU's, atleast 3 recalls,.

What are you talking about? There aren't even 3 recalls on the 350Z! There's only 1, and it's only on the 03 for the crankshaft position sensor. It supposedly only affects 171 of them. See http://www.cars.com/news/stories/103103_storyb_cc.jhtml?page=newsstory&aff=national .

Perhaps some people here don't know the meaning of "recall". Regardless, it sounds like his was a lemon.

Originally posted by cwerdna
What are you talking about? There aren't even 3 recalls on the 350Z! There's only 1, and it's only on the 03 for the crankshaft position sensor. It supposedly only affects 171 of them. See http://www.cars.com/news/stories/103103_storyb_cc.jhtml?page=newsstory&aff=national .

Perhaps some people here don't know the meaning of "recall". Regardless, it sounds like his was a lemon.

sorry I meant to say G35, my bad.

Originally posted by cwerdna
You talked about recalls, not other problems. There are NO recalls on the MAF, coils and sunroof. The crank sensor doesn't affect all 2K2s. Nissan told me that my particular VIN is unaffected. Go look at http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/recalls/recallsearch.cfm and look up the 2K2 Max. You'll see only 3 recalls: 1 for the accelerator stopper, 1 for tranvserse link, and 1 for the crankshaft position sensor.

The headlights issue isn't really a recall. It's pseudo-recall if you live in high HID theft areas (like NY and NJ) where they put on data dots and I think change the brackets. If you don't live in a high HID theft area, you don't get it.

How many recall notices did you get in the mail? I assert you received 3 (or 4 if you count the lights, but you don't live in a high HID theft area) at most.

Correct they changed engines in at the 2K2 model year. But, the one that affected a limited # of GLEs wasn't engine related, nor was the transverse link one.

My bad on the wording then, I meant TSBs as that is what we have gotten with Mazda. My car qualified and recieved work for all of those TSBs as for the headlights yeah they changed the bracket that was it. I was not saying that Nissan was worse just implying that every car has it's quirks. I for one loved my max and got greedy when I went through my divorce and got myself into something I am paying almost double per month for. I love my 8 but i should have waited to get it. I guess it's one of those life lessons you learn?

Originally posted by zerobanger
Cars are about compromise, if you cant afford to maintain an Rx-7 get a less sportscar like a 350Z.

...or and RX-8. Your previous posting is not applicable to just the 350Z.

Originally posted by FritzMan
...or and RX-8. Your previous posting is not applicable to just the 350Z.

Ok, so you are admiting that the rx8 is a sportscar then, right? I did use the term sporstcar, and you did say it applies to the rx-8 also.

The reason I didn't include the Rx-8 is because the the Rx-7 out shines the 350Z in every catagory. Even gas mileage is decent (I get 16-18 city, 23-25 highway). The Rx-8 on the other hand has features you cant get in an Rx-7 or Z such as a back seat, practical use and comfort.

Thanks for clearing that up.

no i am not there still...but i was a month and a half ago...its off the hook....i am trying to get a job there and move back there!!!!!
i lived there for 7 years...left in 90 and its completely diff from when i was there!!!

Originally posted by Sea Ray
Hey Okinawan Majik,

How about letting all of us know what Mazda dealer that you work for. I think everyone on this forum should know this so no one would bring their car to you for sevice since everyone there hates the RX8.

What a great attitude, maybe you should be working at the Nissan dealer instead? They will need all the help they can get when they start replacing cam sensors.

we have a nissan, infiniti, mazda, hummer, porsche, audi, cadillac, olds, buick, and somthing else i cant think....

ohh land rover... we are ranked 5th in the nation mazda service..so they know what they are doing ...3rd gm cadillac service..1 land rover service...we know what we are talking about....but the car..sucks regardless of how good we piece them back together!!!
out techs are good..they just dont like working on shit!!!

I called the mazda dealer to see how much a reman installed in my rx7 was and they said "It depends on how many valves we have to replace".

yea they know what they are doing, sure.

"Ok, so you are admiting that the rx8 is a sportscar then, right? I did use the term sporstcar, and you did say it applies to the rx-8 also."

I didn't know that it came down to me having to "admit" anything. I don't really care about the exact "sport cars" definition, IMO it can have 4 doors even.

I think the only clearing up you need zerobanger is to justify to yourself that the RX-8 suits your future needs.

I will stick to my earlier assessment that the 350Z felt more sporting to me. May not be the case for the orginal thread author, but everyone has their own unique needs.

BTW, some JDM FDs have a back seat. I seriously considered getting one shipped to me when my son was a new born

if you are a moderator...you should be smart enough to tell a question from a hatchet job troll....i had an honest question....YOUR members got out of hand...not my fault....and a search would not have answered my questions....you should know...you are the moderator....so tell me why did you buy one?



RX7 was flawless.....not engine..we all know that..but it was off the hook...almost 10 years later..its still pimped.....mazda will never be able to repeat that success!!!

Originally posted by FritzMan
"Ok, so you are admiting that the rx8 is a sportscar then, right? I did use the term sporstcar, and you did say it applies to the rx-8 also."

I didn't know that it came down to me having to "admit" anything. I don't really care about the exact "sport cars" definition, IMO it can have 4 doors even.

I think the only clearing up you need zerobanger is to justify to yourself that the RX-8 suits your future needs.

I will stick to my earlier assessment that the 350Z felt more sporting to me. May not be the case for the orginal thread author, but everyone has their own unique needs.

BTW, some JDM FDs have a back seat. I seriously considered getting one shipped to me when my son was a new born.

BTW, My "Future Needs" are to have a car for a daily driver. something that is fun and sporty. The rx-8 does fit that bill, but I have not decided on the rx-8.

Also, I have no problem with you feeling like the 350Z is more sporty than the Rx-8. Its all a matter of opinion.

Im just tryin' to have fun on an otherwise boring day :(


About "JDM" FD's having a back seat, some japanese FD's may have had it as an option, I think some country (New Zealand? Australia?) had it as standard and that was the only reason for the option in Japan. Maybe it was in europe that they came stock with a back seat. Eitherway, I am refering to the US Spec FD.

i have been looking does this site have a gallery that works..or maybe its my comp..i wanna see some really good looking aerokits.....or a site that has them? help please!! search didnt work.

Don't forget the cost issue. Adjusting for cost of living increases, the RX7 would be about $50,000. This would be close to the Z06, which would outperform it in most venues and $10,000 more than the Lotus Elise that would offer close performance. In addition, both cars would be much more reliable (yes, even a tempermental british car) and get much better fuel economy.

Originally posted by OKINAWAN MAJIK
no i am not there still...but i was a month and a half ago...its off the hook....i am trying to get a job there and move back there!!!!!
i lived there for 7 years...left in 90 and its completely diff from when i was there!!!
Was stationed there from 96 through 00 when I got stationed in New Mexico. I love it there and would love to go back. Do they have the 8 there or for that matter the 350? I had some friends that brought back 300s, I just waited till I got back and bought one when i got here.

Originally posted by Sea Ray
Hey Okinawan Majik,

How about letting all of us know what Mazda dealer that you work for. I think everyone on this forum should know this so no one would bring their car to you for sevice since everyone there hates the RX8.

What a great attitude, maybe you should be working at the Nissan dealer instead? They will need all the help they can get when they start replacing cam sensors.

:eek:

That would be
Bob Moore AutoPlex
Oklahoma City OK 73114
PH 405-749-9000
http://www.mooreautoplex.com

or Bob Moore Auto Group
http://www.bobmoore.com
PH 1-800-361-7702


This guy "isn't very bright". Just ask for the guy who was on vacation in Okinawa a month ago:confused:

Since I own and RX8, I am going to biased and say go with the 8. as most of the good informed posts above, it's more practical (4 seats) handles better and in my opinion looks better + you can get canzoomers ECU mod for and amazing price and out accelerate a Z.

never out excellerate a Z as for the 8 in oki....didnt see one ..but i am sure they are there...i was there on vacation ..oki and nagoya....and yes if you called..they will transfer you to the mazda building..it stands alone..so to not contaminate the other crap cars we have .....nissan in off site...so they are safe!!!

but oki was a blast...we hung out on international street...mostly..and at the hotel avila nikko up near tori station...man i was a kid when i left...stayed 7 years...lived in sunabe!!

Originally posted by revhappy
Don't forget the cost issue. Adjusting for cost of living increases, the RX7 would be about $50,000. This would be close to the Z06, which would outperform it in most venues and $10,000 more than the Lotus Elise that would offer close performance. In addition, both cars would be much more reliable (yes, even a tempermental british car) and get much better fuel economy.

Ok, you are talking about a car from 1992, so the fact that its even being compared to a Z06 is pretty freakin' amazing. But if the Rx-7 was still being produced in america, it would have 10-12 years of more R & D and have much better performance.

To get a true comparison of cost, look at the other cars of the day. It was motor trend that said "The 1993 Rx-7 will outperform every car under 60K and 2/3's of the cars on the other side of that".

If you want to compare, compare to the ZR1. In every catagory with the exception of Acceleration, the Rx-7 brutally raped the ZR-1. For hell of a lot less. Infact, the Rx-7 was priced at about what the pathetic C4 was.

Originally posted by zerobanger
Ok, you are talking about a car from 1992, so the fact that its even being compared to a Z06 is pretty freakin' amazing. But if the Rx-7 was still being produced in america, it would have 10-12 years of more R & D and have much better performance.

To get a true comparison of cost, look at the other cars of the day. It was motor trend that said "The 1993 Rx-7 will outperform every car under 60K and 2/3's of the cars on the other side of that".

If you want to compare, compare to the ZR1. In every catagory with the exception of Acceleration, the Rx-7 brutally raped the ZR-1. For hell of a lot less. Infact, the Rx-7 was priced at about what the pathetic C4 was.

Oh, the FD was one of my favorite performance cars. Unfortunately, its horrendous reliability issues made it unacceptable. You can bet the bank Mazda would not have released a more powerful FD in subsequent years, unless they did a serious engine renovation (that incidentally is found in the 215-220 HP Renesis that is already having many issues in a naturally-aspirated daily driver car). If you are willing to suffer greatly (or are an extremely capable rotorhead), the FD's great performance is worth it. Otherwise, its just too troublesome for even most hardcore enthusiasts.

Originally posted by renotse
:eek:

That would be
Bob Moore AutoPlex
Oklahoma City OK 73114
PH 405-749-9000
http://www.mooreautoplex.com

or Bob Moore Auto Group
http://www.bobmoore.com
PH 1-800-361-7702


This guy "isn't very bright". Just ask for the guy who was on vacation in Okinawa a month ago:confused:

He also either has problems with his period key or is attempting to communicate in morse code. ;)

Originally posted by revhappy
Oh, the FD was one of my favorite performance cars. Unfortunately, its horrendous reliability issues made it unacceptable. You can bet the bank Mazda would not have released a more powerful FD in subsequent years, unless they did a serious engine renovation (that incidentally is found in the 215-220 HP Renesis that is already having many issues in a naturally-aspirated daily driver car). If you are willing to suffer greatly (or are an extremely capable rotorhead), the FD's great performance is worth it. Otherwise, its just too troublesome for even most hardcore enthusiasts.

Again, im not talking about "reliability", btw..my car is my only car, daily driver has been for the last 2 years.

Its really funny, everytime the remarkable performance of the FD is brought up (and while it today it has very good performance, 12 years ago it was UNHEARD OF), every single time its brought up, the only AMMO you guys have is "Its not reliable".


I guess the FD Is a bitch to own.

Originally posted by revhappy
You can bet the bank Mazda would not have released a more powerful FD in subsequent years, unless they did a serious engine renovation (that incidentally is found in the 215-220 HP Renesis that is already having many issues in a naturally-aspirated daily driver car).

um, but they did, and they fixed the issues which centred around inferior componentry from the factory (notably the rad, vaccum hoses (which were rubber stock... all 72 of them), oil coolers, etc), and ran 12 or 13psi stock in Series 9 trim.

please elaborate on these cataclysmic problems the 13BMSP is having already... little CEL's on stuck tert. port motors or faulty temp sensors keeping the engine in cold-start mode for extended periods aren't more than teething problems.

Originally posted by zerobanger
I guess the FD Is a bitch to own.

well, true dat, but "The - 7 - CAN'T Lose!!!" and since i started dating sensible girls, i've still had the desire for a high maintenance bitch who's a real tiger in bed... despite the headaches: a little more pain for a lot more pleasure... historic owners "get it" (especially the Ferrari guys) :cool:

Z owner here:

I agree with most things that have been said about the Z and the 8. I do have a few comments to add.

The 8 feels faster then it is and the Z feels slower then it is. I was used to driving high reving Honda's and was suprised when I found out that the Z didn't have the high RPM kick and the sound to go along with it. Where you can really tell the Z has a lot of power is when you take off like a mad man from a stop sign. You ram it into second gear and you start going sideways and continue to spin nearly through second gear which tops out at about 60.

As far as race tracks I could care less because I AutoX about twice a year. I will tell you this though. I autox on some parking lots and the 8 is quite a bit faster through the course. These are tracks where you never leave second gear. The other track I did was more high speed 60-100 mph with faster turns and the Z tore up these same RX-8's (same owners/drivers). I also saw many Miata's kicking both our butts on the parking lot course.

Anyone that says the 3.5 is an unreliable motor is an idiot. The motor is near bulletproof. Us Z owners are more worried about our tire feathering problem which has affected a lot of us.

I think they are both nice cars and would be happy with either one. Here is how I would choose:

If you need a car that you need to commute a lot with (45 minutes one way) I would choose the 8. If it's a 3rd car/weekend car I would choose the Z hands down. If you're not used to sports cars the ride in the Z can be a little punishing at first.

Dnclone,
That was a good balanced opinion. And it is a good way to put it without ruffling any feathers. Nice to get back to civil exchanges.

I have had my RX-8 for 3 months, no major problems, just a few little ones. It is a first year car so its going to have a few problems but its under warrenty so they aren't really that big of a deal. The Z cars are good to look at, but I drove one when I was looking for a car and it didnt drive anything like the RX-8. I would pick the 8 over the Z any day.

Originally posted by zerobanger
Again, im not talking about "reliability", btw..my car is my only car, daily driver has been for the last 2 years.

Its really funny, everytime the remarkable performance of the FD is brought up (and while it today it has very good performance, 12 years ago it was UNHEARD OF), every single time its brought up, the only AMMO you guys have is "Its not reliable".


I guess the FD Is a bitch to own.


Yes, some people are just not masochosts! I mean how many people want to buy a car that's constantly breaking down and will need a new engine at 40,000 - 60,000 miles? :confused:

Again, if you are hardcore rotorhead or just a lover (in a stalker sort of way :p ) of the FD, then its worth it. The performance at the time (and still today) was great, but the Z06 and Elise should win the $/performance game today. The problem is that the FD has not been succesful in the US to evolve and remain the best $/performance car. Now, perhaps the Japanese RX7 manufactured up until last year solved some of the reliability problems (and had a bit of a power increase), but the fuel economy and emissions issues likely kept it from being the long-term solution for the rotory, hence the arrival of the Renesis. So far, the Renesis has not shown to ME the overall qualities that will allow it to be placed in a super production car. Now, if Mazda solves some of the problems and puts it in miata-sized car it might be competitive with the Z06 and Elise.

Originally posted by wakeech
um, but they did, and they fixed the issues which centred around inferior componentry from the factory (notably the rad, vaccum hoses (which were rubber stock... all 72 of them), oil coolers, etc), and ran 12 or 13psi stock in Series 9 trim.

please elaborate on these cataclysmic problems the 13BMSP is having already... little CEL's on stuck tert. port motors or faulty temp sensors keeping the engine in cold-start mode for extended periods aren't more than teething problems.


In regards to the FD, please see my post before this one.

As for the Renesis, power has been closer to 215-220 HP with fuel economy of 15-18 MPG for a daily driver! There are the excessive soot deposits on the tailpipe, too much cabin heat, poor air conditioning, ~15% of owners have experience flooding (something I thought left the world with my 1974 Briggs and Stratton powered lawn mower) and an unusual number of complete engine failures. This all occurred within 4-5 months and this car had been in development for what seemed forever.

Perhaps, those are teething issues, but I still need much more evidence that will prove that its benefits still exceed its costs.

Here's your answer

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/101039/article.html

These comparison threads are funny to me. Maybe because I'm getting old... Maybe because I don't really see the '8 and the Z (pronounced 'Zeee' :D) as direct competitors. I looked at both of them before I bought my '8. The Z having 2 seats vs. 4 is what sets the two cars apart. If I didn't have a family, I would have likely bought the Z or a C5. After discussions with the Ole Battle Axe, I decided to get something with four seats for those emergency times when the wife's car was disabled, but we needed to get the family somewhere.

So... the Z has more power. Yep. The Z has more torque. Yep. The Z is faster. Yep. The Z is a nice car. Yep. The '8 is a great car with four seats that are easy to get into. Yep. There's no other four door, four seat car that is as fun to drive, and looks as nice for the price. Yep.

I guess I don't look at 1/4 mile times or HP figures as an indicator of a great car. It's the whole package for what you're looking for. The '8 is definitely one of the best cars in its class. I feel you're wrong if you put the '8 in the same class as the Z. Same goes for the WRX and EVO too. Those two are in the same class together, but not in the same class as the Z or the '8. The WRX and the EVO are two manufacturers base models that they souped up... Much like what you would get if you took a Civic, or a Cavalier and souped it up the same way. You get a cheap car with a lot of power that (IMO) looks funny.

yep

Originally posted by TownDrunk
These comparison threads are funny to me. Maybe because I'm getting old... Maybe because I don't really see the '8 and the Z (pronounced 'Zeee' :D) as direct competitors. I looked at both of them before I bought my '8. The Z having 2 seats vs. 4 is what sets the two cars apart. If I didn't have a family, I would have likely bought the Z or a C5. After discussions with the Ole Battle Axe, I decided to get something with four seats for those emergency times when the wife's car was disabled, but we needed to get the family somewhere.

So... the Z has more power. Yep. The Z has more torque. Yep. The Z is faster. Yep. The Z is a nice car. Yep. The '8 is a great car with four seats that are easy to get into. Yep. There's no other four door, four seat car that is as fun to drive, and looks as nice for the price. Yep.

I guess I don't look at 1/4 mile times or HP figures as an indicator of a great car. It's the whole package for what you're looking for. The '8 is definitely one of the best cars in its class. I feel you're wrong if you put the '8 in the same class as the Z. Same goes for the WRX and EVO too. Those two are in the same class together, but not in the same class as the Z or the '8. The WRX and the EVO are two manufacturers base models that they souped up... Much like what you would get if you took a Civic, or a Cavalier and souped it up the same way. You get a cheap car with a lot of power that (IMO) looks funny.

If you think, the EVO and WRX/STI are just factory souped up Civics, then you need to go back and look at the history of these cars.

Hey Speed D,

That is in extremely poor taste!

Originally posted by revhappy
If you think, the EVO and WRX/STI are just factory souped up Civics, then you need to go back and look at the history of these cars.
I'm aware of the WRC history. I'm referring to the body and interior appointments of the Impreza and Lancer they're derived from. I didn't say they weren't well executed, just that the car chassis' themselves look to be the base model from each companies offerings that are all souped up.

Originally posted by TownDrunk
These comparison threads are funny to me. Maybe because I'm getting old... Maybe because I don't really see the '8 and the Z (pronounced 'Zeee' :D) as direct competitors. I looked at both of them before I bought my '8. The Z having 2 seats vs. 4 is what sets the two cars apart. If I didn't have a family, I would have likely bought the Z or a C5. After discussions with the Ole Battle Axe, I decided to get something with four seats for those emergency times when the wife's car was disabled, but we needed to get the family somewhere.

So... the Z has more power. Yep. The Z has more torque. Yep. The Z is faster. Yep. The Z is a nice car. Yep. The '8 is a great car with four seats that are easy to get into. Yep. There's no other four door, four seat car that is as fun to drive, and looks as nice for the price. Yep.

I guess I don't look at 1/4 mile times or HP figures as an indicator of a great car. It's the whole package for what you're looking for. The '8 is definitely one of the best cars in its class. I feel you're wrong if you put the '8 in the same class as the Z. Same goes for the WRX and EVO too. Those two are in the same class together, but not in the same class as the Z or the '8. The WRX and the EVO are two manufacturers base models that they souped up... Much like what you would get if you took a Civic, or a Cavalier and souped it up the same way. You get a cheap car with a lot of power that (IMO) looks funny.


Hahahaha, coming from the guy with the "souped" up pickup truck!

Originally posted by IkeWRX
Hahahaha, coming from the guy with the "souped" up pickup truck!
C'mon now... You know you wish you had one too!:D

Originally posted by TownDrunk
I'm aware of the WRC history. I'm referring to the body and interior appointments of the Impreza and Lancer they're derived from. I didn't say they weren't well executed, just that the car chassis' themselves look to be the base model from each companies offerings that are all souped up.

So do you think almost any car doesn't share parts with other models or in the case of Mazda, makes (i.e. Ford)? I care much more about the EVO having 100% Japanese parts and being completely assembled there! :D

Originally posted by revhappy
So do you think almost any car doesn't share parts with other models or in the case of Mazda, makes (i.e. Ford)? I care much more about the EVO having 100% Japanese parts and being completely assembled there! :D
Oh, I'm sure Mazdas, Fords, Jags, Volvos, Lincolns, Mercurys, etc... all share parts... What I'm saying is that my '8 doesn't look like a Protoge on steroids. :D

Originally posted by zerobanger
Let me chime in here.

I love my 94 Rx-7. Not only does it look way better than the 350Z, but will out accellerate it, out brake it, out handle it, pull better skid pad #'s, Murder the 350Z on any track, much more fun to drive, 500 lbs lighter, better slalum numbers, Several catagories above the 350Z in the SCCA Handling rankings (actually the TOP catagory, SS). Oh yea and thats just in stock form, a modded one like mine makes even a bigger joke of the 350Z.

Uh....if you hadn't noticed, i was being sarcastic and repeating what the guy that i had quoted said, just replacing the name 8 with Z in order to show that opinions are just that.....opinions. I was in no way presenting any "real" truth.

Originally posted by TownDrunk
Oh, I'm sure Mazdas, Fords, Jags, Volvos, Lincolns, Mercurys, etc... all share parts... What I'm saying is that my '8 doesn't look like a Protoge on steroids. :D


So, then you only care about if its perceived as the same as opposed to it actually being the same?


Elara, this was what I was talking about in the other thread! :D

Originally posted by revhappy
So, then you only care about if its perceived as the same as opposed to it actually being the same?


Oh brother... Some folks just try to read too much into other people's posts. Take my posts at face value (I'm not trying to rip on the other cars) or don't take them at all. Boo hoo hoo...

Originally posted by revhappy
for the Renesis, power has been closer to 215-220 HP with fuel economy of 15-18 MPG for a daily driver! There are the excessive soot deposits on the tailpipe

all these can be traced back to a single condition of this engine: MNAO has this ECU spec'd too rich. this is fact. we have ideas why, but are secondary to the condition that the RX-8 is currently in.

canzoomer's mod will fix this. i don't usually make absolute statements like this, but i am sure that these specific problems, dealing specifically with the engine, are extremely solveable and caused by conditions extraneous to the design, manufacture, or operation fo this motor.

Originally posted by revhappy
too much cabin heat, poor air conditioning, ~15% of owners have experience flooding (something I thought left the world with my 1974 Briggs and Stratton powered lawn mower) and an unusual number of complete engine failures. This all occurred within 4-5 months and this car had been in development for what seemed forever.

Perhaps, those are teething issues, but I still need much more evidence that will prove that its benefits still exceed its costs.

now the heat and air conditioning are legitimate issues, and those ought to be adjusted in following model years.

the flooding issue: symptom of rookie ownership, overrich ECU tuning, and the coldstart sequence.

complete engine failures?? tell me about one engine that never broke ;) it happens, and the issues specific to those individual failures will have to be resolved as the engine evolves...

i'm not saying it's perfect, and i recognize how disappointingly far from perfect it is, but there's no doubt in my mind that this motor isn't unbelievably brilliant.

Here is an OPINION from a non rx8/350z driver.

Both great cars but when you get down to specifics...the appeal changes.

If I wanted a pure track car...I'd go with the Z hands down.
If I wanted a daily driver that I could tune. rx8 all the way.

I look at it from this perspective. I get in good seat time in an RX8 considering that fact that my girl has one and I get to drive it alot. In the end, it is how that car makes you feel.

I myself dirve a 2001 Trans Am. Doesnt handle like either of these cars in the stock form...I will admit. But with some work I can get it to where I want it. I drove the 350z and the RX8. I see them all over the road. But I tell you, everytime I start my LS1...and here that rumble...I forget those two cars even exist. When I get into the driver's seat... I am king. And that is how I decide. Numbers are great, price is great, track times are great...but to me none of that matters. In the end, it is your passion for the car that will make the final decision. And it will decide what will become of your car. I tell you this, after I get my Z06...Im stilling keeping my Trans Am...even though the Z06 is superior in every way...I still love the way the T/A makes me feel.

Silver... yeah, that's what it's about.

Too bad people have to spend more time picking each other's posts apart to get away from this sentiment.

Although I will buy an RX-8 and never buy a T/A or Camaro, I still appreciate and like them.

I recall autocrossing one once... it honestly felt like a really "big" version of the 1st generation RX-7: user-friendly handling (great trail-braking), good power and was just *fun*.

Originally posted by TownDrunk
Oh brother... Some folks just try to read too much into other people's posts. Take my posts at face value (I'm not trying to rip on the other cars) or don't take them at all. Boo hoo hoo...

The "face value" was "looks".

Originally posted by wakeech
all these can be traced back to a single condition of this engine: MNAO has this ECU spec'd too rich. this is fact. we have ideas why, but are secondary to the condition that the RX-8 is currently in.

canzoomer's mod will fix this. i don't usually make absolute statements like this, but i am sure that these specific problems, dealing specifically with the engine, are extremely solveable and caused by conditions extraneous to the design, manufacture, or operation fo this motor.

I hope these problems are solvable. However, the original claim of 250 HP sounds dubious as even the pre-production ECU untampered models still only got mid - upper 14s in the 1/4 mile. The RX8 at ~ 3,000 lbs. should have been closer to the S2000's 1/4 mile times (high 13s to low 14s) as the power-weight ratios should have been closer.

Still, Mazda cannot simply use Canzoomer's ECU reflash as it will burn out the Cat much quicker than EPU regulations allow. ECU reflashes are also available (or can be developed) for many other cars, so the RX8 will still be at a relative power disadvantage if both cars have reflashes.



Originally posted by wakeech
now the heat and air conditioning are legitimate issues, and those ought to be adjusted in following model years.

the flooding issue: symptom of rookie ownership, overrich ECU tuning, and the coldstart sequence.

complete engine failures?? tell me about one engine that never broke ;) it happens, and the issues specific to those individual failures will have to be resolved as the engine evolves...

i'm not saying it's perfect, and i recognize how disappointingly far from perfect it is, but there's no doubt in my mind that this motor isn't unbelievably brilliant.

I hope the potential is there as this engine would be a dream if this is true. Unfortunately, at least in production cars in recent years, the rotary has been dissapointing from a broad, holistic viewpoint. :(

Originally posted by revhappy
The "face value" was "looks".

You're right. I commented on the looks of those two cars stating that in my opinion they looked funny. Apparently you can't share your opinion here without others trying to make a big deal of it.

Looks matter. Anyone who's done any dating should realize that. The STi and Evo deliver race car performance at a reasonable price. They also look like what they are: Heavily modded econo-boxes.

There's nothing wrong with liking that look, but there's also nothing wrong with pointing it out.

Originally posted by MMGDC
Looks matter. Anyone who's done any dating should realize that. The STi and Evo deliver race car performance at a reasonable price. They also look like what they are: Heavily modded econo-boxes.

There's nothing wrong with liking that look, but there's also nothing wrong with pointing it out.

The theme of many posts on here are that looks are more important to the point is that they would buy a car that looked great and drove like crap. That is why a "vain" reputation is in the cards if this continues.

Or you could be perpetuating that myth rev, by suggesting that those of us who have chosen the RX8 are not interested in performance simply because we didn't pick YOUR favorite to purchase..

Originally posted by Psylence
Or you could be perpetuating that myth rev, by suggesting that those of us who have chosen the RX8 are not interested in performance simply because we didn't pick YOUR favorite to purchase..

http://images.ar15.com/forums/smiles/anim_beer.gif

Originally posted by Psylence
Or you could be perpetuating that myth rev, by suggesting that those of us who have chosen the RX8 are not interested in performance simply because we didn't pick YOUR favorite to purchase..

No, because of their comments on other cars.

Originally posted by jdmlover79
if you looking for good looking and performance then go for z but if you looking for more room, good looking, smoothness, rareness (i don't see many rx-8 yet on the street) and girls ^^ (i saw a lot of girls looking at rx-8 when i was test driving one) then rx-8 is better.

this is my opinion ^^


Ummm here in Austin I've been seeing more and more 8s on the street granted it was rare for most of 03 but I think thats not so much the case anymore. How many has mazda sold in 03? I know that Z sales in North America are about 50K for this year...for comparison

Originally posted by revhappy
The theme of many posts on here are that looks are more important to the point is that they would buy a car that looked great and drove like crap. That is why a "vain" reputation is in the cards if this continues.


None of the cars I've seen mentioned in this thread drive like crap... in fact they range from well above average to jaw dropping in performance.

If the RX-8 drove like an '83 Plymouth Reliant, I'd be hearing ya, but that's not really the case. However, I'll concede that if you're intent on making your life an ongoing tribute to 2Fast2Furious then yes, you'd be silly to get an RX-8.

Different wants, different needs, different cars. No right or wrong answers.

Originally posted by MMGDC
None of the cars I've seen mentioned in this thread drive like crap...

I was about to point that out....
Are we losing so much perspective??

Originally posted by revhappy
Still, Mazda cannot simply use Canzoomer's ECU reflash as it will burn out the Cat much quicker than EPU regulations allow. ECU reflashes are also available (or can be developed) for many other cars, so the RX8 will still be at a relative power disadvantage if both cars have reflashes.

I hope the potential is there as this engine would be a dream if this is true. Unfortunately, at least in production cars in recent years, the rotary has been dissapointing from a broad, holistic viewpoint. :(

*sigh* i don't give a flying crap if Mazda fixes it or not, 'cause people who're willing to sacrifice more (like noise, fuel economy, emissions equipment longevity of a car they're not going to keep for more than 5 or 6 years, etc) to get more will do just that: make the damned thing into exactly what they want.

the potential IS there, and i find it extremely hard to believe that you can say the 13BREW was a broad disappointment!! :eek:
i think the biggest problem with the rotary is that it's applied incorrectly: too many comprimises are made for people who aren't "getting" it, but i suppose that's the only way you're gonna sell very many of them. too bad, really too bad...

"True", other cars might have and ECU reflash, Canzoomers is a piggyback unit. but the whole point of his research and mod is that Mazda severly detuned the car due to emissions compliance, this also happened to hold back a lot of H.P. canzoomer is tricking the stock air/fuel ratios to allow for 25 to 50 W.H.P. depending on stage, I doubt your going to see that much improvement with another car with a reflash as that cars H.P. is pretty much at full potential anyway, unless you start adding some meat, such as internals, extrude honed, cams, pistons, headers, intake manifolds and forced induction.

Originally posted by wakeech
*sigh* i don't give a flying crap if Mazda fixes it or not, 'cause people who're willing to sacrifice more (like noise, fuel economy, emissions equipment longevity of a car they're not going to keep for more than 5 or 6 years, etc) to get more will do just that: make the damned thing into exactly what they want.

Unfortunately, for me the car should offer that kind of performance out of the factory when a car is advertized as a sports car. (I don't mind the ability to add additional power with mods from there :D ) I have heard somewhere that the cats would only last around 20,000 miles or so with Canzoomer's mod (I could be wrong here) you are looking at replacing the cats every 20 monhts or going with a test pipe. In addition, you will be voiding many parts of the warranty (or at least having to fight like hell to get claims honored) when you start adding mods (yes, an ECU Reflash is not usually looked for by the dealer, but if Canzoomer becomes a rich man then maybe they will begin to test for reflashes to deny warranty claims)

Originally posted by wakeech
the potential IS there, and i find it extremely hard to believe that you can say the 13BREW was a broad disappointment!! :eek:
i think the biggest problem with the rotary is that it's applied incorrectly: too many comprimises are made for people who aren't "getting" it, but i suppose that's the only way you're gonna sell very many of them. too bad, really too bad...

You have been around here a long time too. A year to two years back people were talking about an S2000 killer, Slalom times around 70 MPH, etc. It just has not panned out yet. However, I agree with you that the biggest problem the RX8 has IS that its the wrong application for the rotary - the powerplant should be in a lighter car - say a Celica or smaller.

Originally posted by JimW
"True", other cars might have and ECU reflash, Canzoomers is a piggyback unit. but the whole point of his research and mod is that Mazda severly detuned the car due to emissions compliance, this also happened to hold back a lot of H.P. canzoomer is tricking the stock air/fuel ratios to allow for 25 to 50 W.H.P. depending on stage, I doubt your going to see that much improvement with another car with a reflash as that cars H.P. is pretty much at full potential anyway, unless you start adding some meat, such as internals, extrude honed, cams, pistons, headers, intake manifolds and forced induction.

What are canzoomer's stages? Do they just involve the reflash or do they involve bolt-ons, etc? Also, what air-fuel ratio is he running?

Originally posted by austins2k2003
Ummm here in Austin I've been seeing more and more 8s on the street granted it was rare for most of 03 but I think thats not so much the case anymore. How many has mazda sold in 03? I know that Z sales in North America are about 50K for this year...for comparison

In the US, based on the latest sales figures I have, Mazda has sold 10,267 RX-8s so far this year. Nissan has sold 34,604 350Zs so far this year. I don't have Canadian or Mexican figures handy. I do know that as a whole, VERY few cars are sold in Canada compared to the US.

You can see the sales reports at:
http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/031202/25745_1.html
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/031202/latu099_1.html

The RX-8 is a lot more luxerious car than the 350Z. If you want raw horsepower for bragging rights, I would get the 350Z. But if you want a car you can relax in while you drive fast, then the RX-8 is for you.

I was just thinking tonight on my way home from coffee how much I liked this car. It was cold out and my wife and I both had the heat warmers turned on. We were playing a nice ambient music CD which sounded great on the 300watt Bose radio, it really surrounded us with rich sound.

The dash looks great at night, and I love how there is a blue flash as the needle increases on the tachometer, its like the red needle is moving so fast it gives an effect of some sort. The inside of the RX-8 is just very plush and feels very expensive, like a BMW.

The 350Z has ugly yellow lights on the dash, a very weak stereo and no leather seats (except for the touring model). It just doesn't feel like you are getting your money's worth.

The RX-8 feels like a classic sports car with an emphasis on refinement, not raw power. It looks great, feels great and moves.

The 350Z is more hardcore in my opinion. It looks mean, the engine accelerates like a muscle car and eventually will just wear you out, especially on long drives.

And just for the record, the RX-8 was on Car and Drivers 10 best cars list, came in second to the Evo for Automobile Car of the Year, was Kiplingers car for 2004, beat out the 350z in the Edmunds article.

Test drive both cars and ask yourself if you reallt need that big engine feel the 350z gives you. Because if you don't race, there is no need for that engine, especially in the city. Wouldn't you rather be driving in a comortable car with the music system sounding good and the moonroof open? :D


Plug over.

Originally posted by Ioman
The RX-8 is a lot more luxerious car than the 350Z. If you want raw horsepower for bragging rights, I would get the 350Z. But if you want a car you can relax in while you drive fast, then the RX-8 is for you.

And just for the record, the RX-8 was on Car and Drivers 10 best cars list...
The 350Z was on C&D 10 best cars list for 2003, won 2003 Motorweek's Drivers' Choice awards for best of the year and best performance car along w/a bunch of other awards.

But yes, I agree w/you Ioman on many of your points although I don't feel the Z's yellowish dash lights are ugly. Yeah, the Z is definitely more hardcore.

I just did an interesting comparo on some stretches of highway (some if it very bumpy) w/my Z, riding in my friend's RX-8 [not driving it, I can't drive stick worth beans.. please don't shoot me] and my 02 Maxima. I will say it was an interesting progression.

The RX-8 definitely has a smoother ride (not really bouncy, whereas my Z is) than my Enthusiast Z and the engine and exhaust sound NOTHING alike. What's funny is in the RX-8, I feel like I hear mostly exhaust noise and little engine noise. There was a bit less road noise in the 8 than the Z. Also, the noise from the rain splashing in the wheel wells was a lot quieter on the 8. The door sills aren't as high in the 8 so you don't feel like you're sitting as low as you are in the Z. As I mentioned before, the 8's interior is definitely of far better quality than the Z. In an underground parking garage, you can definitely hear a really nice throaty exhaust noise from the Z. The 8 sounds totally different and DOES sound turbine engine like.

The Max has a way smoother ride than either, has less engine and exhaust noise than either (even though it uses the same engine as my Z, it doesn't sound anything alike). You sit higher in the Max it has a non-sporty exhaust sound.

For me, if if the 8 had a bit more power, got rid of the rear doors (looks funny to me, or if it just looked like a Z), and there were no engine probs, I'd be more inclined to buy it. But yeah, I can see the appeal of the 8.

The Z, and even the G35C scream sports car. I've ridden in all three of the cars, and driven the 6MT G35C. They all have their good and bad points...the RX8's bad point being that it dosen't "go fast" but the engine is so responsive, I'd think you'd have to be a speed freak to care. The Z and G both have an extremely seductive exhaust note. It was actually designed to mimic the sound of a V12. The RX8 just screams rotary when you floor it. It sounds more like a rotary than my friend's old Turbo II.

IMO, the RX8 has better interior materials than the 350Z and G35C. The G has pretty stiff roll motions, probably due to the wide tires on it. The suspension reacts quickly to bumps. The Z is even more reactive to bumps as spring rate up front is twice as high as the G...in fact, some 350Z owners complain about "porpising"

Like Jeremy Clarkson's cohost said, the Z is a "big BUTCH car". It feels sporty, but in a very hefty sort of way. When you change the gears, it feels like you're shoving huge heavy industrial gears around, and when the torque pulls you into your seat, it's like a freight-train. In contrast, the RX8 dances lightly on it's feet, dosen't bruise your ass when you come off a driveway, and happens to be a nice place for all the passengers.

Originally posted by Elara
Well, there's no recalls at all on the 8 so far.....

:)

No just that little pesky buy back thing/engine flooding/blown engine/15 mpg .....


shhhh! don't talk bad about the 8 or you will turn into a troll

Big deal a FEW engines have blown. From what I read its a very small insignifigant number. I can point to threads on the S2000 board and the 350Z board that had engines replaced under 6000 miles.

when the 99 miata came out ALOT of engines were lost due to the #4 bearing issue those were all fixed.

I believe in the RX-8 and what mazda is doing. Good, bad or indifferent the rotary is what put mazda on the map. Its the one thing that sets the "RX" series apart from every other car. Its a very unique car, nothing looks like it, nothing drives like it.

What is it that makes a car special? Sure car and driver put the Rx-8 on the 10 Best list (notice 350Z is NOT there). Its got the best reviews I have seen since the Rx-7 in late 1992. Despite having low power it has managed to win its comparisions with the competition? Notice that every single review talks about how on paper its nothing special but when you drive it you realize what a sports car is supposed to be?

The only thing the 350Z has on the rx-8 is alot of low end torque. Big deal the 350Z can do low/mid 14's and is roughly 3/4 of a second faster than a Rx-8 with same skill driver. The 350Z isn't exactly fast either. You want power and speed neither car is that great, but as far as being fun to drive, handling, agility and character we know who the winner is.

Originally posted by dtmf
No just that little pesky buy back thing/engine flooding/blown engine/15 mpg .....


shhhh! don't talk bad about the 8 or you will turn into a troll

If you state you position politely, as in: "I don't like the 8 because I don't like the HP/I don't think it has enough torque/I don't trust the engine because it's a first year run" and not "The 8 sucks ass and you are stupid cause you bought it" no one cares that you don't like it and say so. You're more than entitled to your own opinion. Look at Ike. He doesn't seem to like it, yet because he's NICE about it, he's pretty well respected.

As for your little jab, there- ever so clever of you to ignore the actual facts. The buy back didn't have to happen- Mazda was NICE to everyone. They were well within their rights to go "oops, we screwed up, sorry about that, here's the real hp." and leave it at that. How many other companys have done that and actually tried to make good on their mistake? Engine flooding hasn't happened the majority of us, and the same goes for the blown engines. We have heard a rumor that there have been as many as what, 70 total? Out of more than 10,000 cars now floating around? And we don't have any hard proof from Mazda or anyone else (no offense Canzoomer).

There are no more issues with this car than any other first year run. And there are no recalls. So what's your point?

Has anyone seen the info re the 350Z's front end problem? Seems that the front suspension has something out of wack that causes premature wear of the front tires. There hasn't been any recall, but as I understand, Nissan is replacing tires under warranty while they try to find a way to correct the alignment problem.
The point being, all cars have some problems, particularly new ones. I've owned upteen dz cars and have yet to find the perfect one. Up to this point (4,500mi.) however, I haven't experienced any problems with my RX-8. Doesn't mean I won't, but none yet. My Miata has been trouble-free for 18k miles (recalled for the foglight bracket), including 6-7 autocross events. Oh, the OEM tires sucked and were replaced at 11.5k miles.
Comparisons aren't worth a whole lot in my book. A "good" car is one that you like to drive, be seen in, and isn't in the shop all the time. JMHO.:cool:

I'd be curious to see those threads on 350Z forums. I can't think of any on lightly or unmodded Zs that needed new engines.

Originally posted by zerobanger
Big deal a FEW engines have blown. From what I read its a very small insignifigant number. I can point to threads on the S2000 board and the 350Z board that had engines replaced under 6000 miles.

What is it that makes a car special? Sure car and driver put the Rx-8 on the 10 Best list (notice 350Z is NOT there). I
The only thing the 350Z has on the rx-8 is alot of low end torque. Big deal the 350Z can do low/mid 14's

As for 10Best, the Z was on there for 2003. See http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=33&article_id=2423. As for 1/4 mile... there's a lot of variation, but the fastest stock time I've seen so far is 13.73. It seems to be in the very high 13s or low 14s unless the driver was lousy or they were at high altitudes and/or high temps.

Originally posted by Elara
IfThe buy back didn't have to happen- Mazda was NICE to everyone. They were well within their rights to go "oops, we screwed up, sorry about that, here's the real hp." and leave it at that. How many other companys have done that and actually tried to make good on their mistake?

Hyundai was one:
http://www.auto.com/reuters/2002-09-09T201506Z_01_N0922.htm
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news02/hyundai_power.html

Mazda did it before:
http://www.findarticles.com/cf_dls/m4PRN/2001_March_16/71723407/p1/article.jhtml

Originally posted by cwerdna
I'd be curious to see those threads on 350Z forums. I can't think of any on lightly or unmodded Zs that needed new engines.


Supercharged Zs have blown engines. Some of the people on the board who aren't too bright are shying away from it suddenly. One of the guys who has a supercharged Z (and blew the engine) said he expected it because he drove his car like it was intended to be driven.

Originally posted by areitu
Supercharged Zs have blown engines. Some of the people on the board who aren't too bright are shying away from it suddenly. One of the guys who has a supercharged Z (and blew the engine) said he expected it because he drove his car like it was intended to be driven.
Err... I wouldn't consider supercharging to fall under the category of unmodded or lightly modded cars! Those don't count. Sure, the Smithtown Nissan guys ran >300 shots of NOS (as high as 375) on stock internals and blew their engine... but that's insane! That's 375 hp to an engine that produces 287... Also, not my idea of a light mod.

How many of the failed RX-8 engines had forced induction or NOS (well, that's also FI too)?

Originally posted by cwerdna
I'd be curious to see those threads on 350Z forums. I can't think of any on lightly or unmodded Zs that needed new engines.



As for 10Best, the Z was on there for 2003. See http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=33&article_id=2423. As for 1/4 mile... there's a lot of variation, but the fastest stock time I've seen so far is 13.73. It seems to be in the very high 13s or low 14s unless the driver was lousy or they were at high altitudes and/or high temps.

13.73, LOL Dreaming is good.

Originally posted by zerobanger
13.73, LOL Dreaming is good.
Take a look at the post by 1.8T at http://www.my350z.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=36456&perpage=20&pagenumber=5

and stx at http://www.my350z.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=36456&perpage=20&pagenumber=5

I would like to see the timeslips though... What's the best 1/4 mile here on a stock 8? I recall Judge Ito had a 14.5 and I recall him mentioning that he'd be drag racing for 15 years. Heck, I've only had my license for 12 and only had a car worth racing for 2...

Originally posted by cwerdna
Take a look at the post by 1.8T at http://www.my350z.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=36456&perpage=20&pagenumber=5

and stx at http://www.my350z.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=36456&perpage=20&pagenumber=5

I would like to see the timeslips though... What's the best 1/4 mile here on a stock 8? I recall Judge Ito had a 14.5 and I recall him mentioning that he'd be drag racing for 15 years. Heck, I've only had my license for 12 and only had a car worth racing for 2...

I ran 12.99 @ 108 in my bone stock 1994 Rx-7.:D

and Mr ITO ran a 14.2

Originally posted by zerobanger
and Mr ITO ran a 14.2

I see a 14.32 http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17031 but he wrecked his 1st gear in the process. Hmmm... My bad though... his 14.32 post was pretty recent. I'd been following his 14.5 thread from awhile ago. Where's his 14.2?

Originally posted by zerobanger
I ran 12.99 @ 108 in my bone stock 1994 Rx-7.:D
I ran a 13.1 @ 108 w/12.5 pounds of boost on 18" wheels & street tires. What type of tires did you use?

Originally posted by cwerdna
I see a 14.32 http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17031 but he wrecked his 1st gear in the process. Hmmm... My bad though... his 14.32 post was pretty recent. I'd been following his 14.5 thread from awhile ago. Where's his 14.2?

Ok, you said 14.4 I said 14.2, its 14.3. Who the fuk cares? the 350Z and RX-8 both make pathetic drag cars. One has doesn't have enough torque to get it off the line, the other is a fat pig that has the top end of a butterfly (and an interior that was designed by a 10 year old with his first lego set).

Originally posted by zerobanger
Ok, you said 14.4 I said 14.2, its 14.3. Who the fuk cares? the 350Z and RX-8 both make pathetic drag cars. One has doesn't have enough torque to get it off the line, the other is a fat pig that has the top end of a butterfly (and an interior that was designed by a 10 year old with his first lego set).

I think I quote you in my rx7club.com sig. :D

The 350Z dosen't have top end. The RX8 does. From the back seat, at least. The 350Z and the G35C are extremely similar cars, platform and engine-wise. In fact, the G35C posts better skidpad numbers than the 350Z (less tailhappy at the limit, better tires). A friend of mine has a G35C 6MT and the Technosquare ECU remap. Instead of the engine pulling the same through the rev range, it gains top end where power usually peters out. Think of it as something like the Canzoomer mod. Makes it a REAL sports car rather than a great chassis with a truck engine.

I prefer the 350Z's interior over the G35C's, but the RX8 over both. Unless you stare at the door or the center console all day, the 350Z interior really isn't that bad.

Look what i started.. :)

well i think im getting rx8. More i look at it, more i like it.
Interior is so much better. i got 2 cars that are fast...dont need another afast car.

Originally posted by Elara
If you state you position politely, as in: "I don't like the 8 because I don't like the HP/I don't think it has enough torque/I don't trust the engine because it's a first year run" and not "The 8 sucks ass and you are stupid cause you bought it" no one cares that you don't like it and say so. You're more than entitled to your own opinion. Look at Ike. He doesn't seem to like it, yet because he's NICE about it, he's pretty well respected.

As for your little jab, there- ever so clever of you to ignore the actual facts. The buy back didn't have to happen- Mazda was NICE to everyone. They were well within their rights to go "oops, we screwed up, sorry about that, here's the real hp." and leave it at that. How many other companys have done that and actually tried to make good on their mistake? Engine flooding hasn't happened the majority of us, and the same goes for the blown engines. We have heard a rumor that there have been as many as what, 70 total? Out of more than 10,000 cars now floating around? And we don't have any hard proof from Mazda or anyone else (no offense Canzoomer).

There are no more issues with this car than any other first year run. And there are no recalls. So what's your point?

Do you actually think Mazda did this to be nice? They did it to prevent future lawsuits and preserve some credibility and not make people angry so the future of their brand is less tarnished. If you look at the numbers Mazda came up with it's right on the threshold of 5% and I believe that's the point where people are able to take legal action. Had they rated the car at 237 (which still seems to be out of wack) it would have come out to 5.1%, and I have yet to see why Mazda came up with the 238 number other than to keep themselves out of legal hot water. The buyback and free maintenance offer was to save themselves money in the future and many lawsuits, not to be nice.

Also, you're nutty if you think the RX-8 has topend and the Z doesn't, everything I've seen seems to point to the Z pulling away very hard from the RX-8 after the 100mph point is broken.

Originally posted by IkeWRX
Do you actually think Mazda did this to be nice? They did it to prevent future lawsuits and preserve some credibility and not make people angry so the future of their brand is less tarnished. If you look at the numbers Mazda came up with it's right on the threshold of 5% and I believe that's the point where people are able to take legal action. Had they rated the car at 237 (which still seems to be out of wack) it would have come out to 5.1%, and I have yet to see why Mazda came up with the 238 number other than to keep themselves out of legal hot water. The buyback and free maintenance offer was to save themselves money in the future and many lawsuits, not to be nice.

Also, you're nutty if you think the RX-8 has topend and the Z doesn't, everything I've seen seems to point to the Z pulling away very hard from the RX-8 after the 100mph point is broken.

I dont know about the rx-8, but I drove the 350Z and its a DOG (other than when first hit the gas). at 4000 rpm you feel like a butterfly.

IMHO, MNAO had two options.

Leave the power and deal with new emissions requirements on the cats that require more longevity than older standards.

Change the power, increase cat life, and as a premptive motion, offered buybacks to the people that have purchased them.

Ike, have you driven an RX8 at speed? For some reason it feels like it's pulling faster in the higher gears.

Sure the Z has more tq/hp, it's a great 2 seater with a V6 in it ;)

But the USDM cars are pretty much the same, except for the port reflash .

So if the ecu were putting out JDM specs, would that technically be "stock"??

Gotta love the Z!! Nissan did right with that car for what it is!

Originally posted by syntrix
IMHO, MNAO had two options.

Leave the power and deal with new emissions requirements on the cats that require more longevity than older standards.

Change the power, increase cat life, and as a premptive motion, offered buybacks to the people that have purchased them.

Ike, have you driven an RX8 at speed? For some reason it feels like it's pulling faster in the higher gears.

Sure the Z has more tq/hp, it's a great 2 seater with a V6 in it ;)

But the USDM cars are pretty much the same, except for the port reflash .

So if the ecu were putting out JDM specs, would that technically be "stock"??

Gotta love the Z!! Nissan did right with that car for what it is!

I only took the RX-8 to about 90 on my testdrive. But if you look at the mag numbers, the G35 and Z pull much stronger at higher MPH even against the pre production car. For instance in C&D the G35 beat the RX-8 to 130 by 6.7 seconds, at 130mph that is an obscene amount of carlengths. It's even more telling when you consider there was only a 1.3 second difference 0-100. Then consider the Z is lighter and has a slightly more freeflowing exhaust and 10 more HP.

Zerobanger, I find it impossible that you actually drove a Z, or you;re just misrepresenting. It's hardly a dog and I think just about everyone that has ever driven one will agree with me whether they like it or not.

Ike

Originally posted by IkeWRX

Zerobanger, I find it impossible that you actually drove a Z, or you;re just misrepresenting. It's hardly a dog and I think just about everyone that has ever driven one will agree with me whether they like it or not.

Ike

too fucking bad. I drove one 3 weeks ago at the nissan dealer in Oakland california. Like I said, when I first hit the gas it was great, then it got really boring. It has NO top end.

I thought the weight of the Z was about 3200-3300. 3225 at edmunds (http://edmunds.com/new/2004/nissan/350z/100282492/specs.html?tid=edmunds.n.prices.moreresearch.0.3.N issan*)

Might want to 2x check the RX8 weight ;) With popular options: 3,029 lbs [ http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/displayPage.action?pageParameter=modelsSpecsSpecs&vehicleCode=RX8 ] <- hope that link works, and some sport RX8's are in the 29's.

How is the 350Z lighter?

Originally posted by syntrix
How is the 350Z lighter?

I believe he was comparing the G & Z

Originally posted by RX8-TX
I believe he was comparing the G & Z

Correct.


Zero, if the Z is a dog then it's a Greyhound and the RX-8 is a Beagle.

Ok, that makes sense!

Originally posted by IkeWRX
Correct.


Zero, if the Z is a dog then it's a Greyhound and the RX-8 is a Beagle.

Dude, I don't like Greyhounds....I like Chihuahua's!

Originally posted by IkeWRX
Correct.


Zero, if the Z is a dog then it's a Greyhound and the RX-8 is a Beagle.

I dont own an Rx-8. I own an Rx-7, compared to my car the 350Z feels like a turtle.

Just the facts.

The G/Z do feel like turtles without the Technosquare ECU flash. They lean it out a bit on top and it gains a lot more pull. Stock, it basically feels the same when you floor it at 4500rpm and 5500rpm. They might have more actual power at the top end than the RX8, but the engine pulls flatly through the rev-range. That's the point we're trying to get across.

The RX8 starts off gently and surges forward when all those ports click open. It makes the car feel light. I liked it a lot in stock form, I can't imagine the port reflash.

Originally posted by zerobanger
I dont own an Rx-8. I own an Rx-7, compared to my car the 350Z feels like a turtle.

Just the facts.

so then the rx-8 must be a snail?

Ike, R&T has the 8 from 0-100 in 15.9, and the G35 14.9 I believe

you keep refering to C&D 0-130 time, and I have seen no link or info on this. The cars are almost identical in the 0-60 and 1/4 mile. But as per usual you will find something or say something to try and put holes in any info that is presented to you. The street start time for the G35 is lower, but with any highreving engine like the 8, it is going to be a weakness. In fact, R&T had to launch the G35 to get a 6.1 0-60. Just face it, between the 2, you have almost identical performance.

Originally posted by Morning Wood
so then the rx-8 must be a snail?

The rx-8's trap speed is what, 4 mph less than the z? 95 vs 99?

they are both snails. but the rx8 out performs the z in all other catagories. rx8 baby!!

Originally posted by IkeWRX
Correct.


Zero, if the Z is a dog then it's a Greyhound and the RX-8 is a Beagle.

Only if the beagle is Snoopy, the WWII flying ace in his Sopwith Camel! :D

Originally posted by Broker73
Ike, R&T has the 8 from 0-100 in 15.9, and the G35 14.9 I believe

you keep refering to C&D 0-130 time, and I have seen no link or info on this. The cars are almost identical in the 0-60 and 1/4 mile. But as per usual you will find something or say something to try and put holes in any info that is presented to you. The street start time for the G35 is lower, but with any highreving engine like the 8, it is going to be a weakness. In fact, R&T had to launch the G35 to get a 6.1 0-60. Just face it, between the 2, you have almost identical performance.

Umm, if you've ever done drag racing, you'l find 1 second in the 1/4 mile is VERY significant. I wouldn't call them nearly identical. Both those 1/4 mile times sound a bit on the high side (esp. the 8's). Not sure which transmission was used on the G35 [also not sure if it was a coupe or sedan, coupe has 20 hp more] but that sounds high too.

I know 02-03 stock Maximas (same engine as Z and G35, but rated at only 255 hp) can run a 14.6 w/an auto at best and 14.2-14.3 at best w/a manual. I've personally done a 14.9 at best on my stock 02 Maxima GXE auto w/o brake torquing.

re-read my post, I never said there was a 1 sec difference in the 1/4 mile. In the Dec 29th addition of Edmunds I believe, the test for the 8 pulled 14.7 in the 1/4. This is only a few 10ths off the G35 Coupe. They are almost identical in the 1/4 mile.

Originally posted by Broker73
re-read my post, I never said there was a 1 sec difference in the 1/4 mile. In the Dec 29th addition of Edmunds I believe, the test for the 8 pulled 14.7 in the 1/4. This is only a few 10ths off the G35 Coupe. They are almost identical in the 1/4 mile.

Which post do you want me to re-read? Your post said "Ike, R&T has the 8 from 0-100 in 15.9, and the G35 14.9 I believe...

you keep refering to C&D 0-130 time, and I have seen no link or info on this. The cars are almost identical in the 0-60 and 1/4 mile."

So, you've started out w/a 1 second difference, assert the performance is almost identical and now you've thrown in some other new numbers.

It's very difficult to compare 1/4 mile times between different publications. There's a lot of variation due to driver skill, track conditions, altitude, temperature, humidity, how you launch, etc. Heck, even within the same mag, sometimes there a hilarious amount of variation in 1/4 mile times and braking distances. If I had access to my October 02 Car and Driver issue (800 miles away right now) where they bashed the 02 Maxima SE, and then looked in the same issue at the reviews that included the 3.2TL and G35, you'll see what I mean.

Back to your numbers, since you are so fond of quoting random publications, Edmunds pulled off a 15.1 in the 1/4 mile on a manual RX-8. http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/101039/page004.html

Edmunds achieved 14.66 using an AUTOMATIC G35 coupe. See http://www.edmunds.com/new/2004/infiniti/g35/100330765/roadtestarticle.html?articleId=83174&editorialpage=page001 .

Almost identical? I think not.... if they only had some times for a manual G35 coupe or an automatic RX-8 to compare.

But on that page:

http://edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/101039/page004.html#ets

There's a .5 difference between the RX8 and the 350Z.

Must be those extra seats in the back of the RX8 ;)

And surprisingly, the RX8 wins in braking AND slalom.

Originally posted by syntrix
But on that page:

http://edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/101039/page004.html#ets

There's a .5 difference between the RX8 and the 350Z.

Must be those extra seats in the back of the RX8 ;)

And surprisingly, the RX8 wins in braking AND slalom.
But the 14.6 for the 1/4 mile on a manual Z sucks, just like the time for the 8 sucks. There are people w/stock automatic Zs that have run 14.0. I've seen two people w/stock manuals that have claimed to run 13.7x.

claimed to run 13.7 on stock 350Z

Yah ok, if you believe that then enough said:p

variation does show up between mags. And as far as Edmunds, if they did not do a hard launch, then 1/4 mile time will vary.

Originally posted by Broker73
claimed to run 13.7 on stock 350Z

Yah ok, if you believe that then enough said:p

variation does show up between mags. And as far as Edmunds, if they did not do a hard launch, then 1/4 mile time will vary.
I'd send you the URLs of their posts, but you be registered on my350z.com to read any of them. I'd like to see their timeslips as well. I'd say that the best anyone w/a stock Z manual can realisticly do is 13.9.

There seem to be a lot of staunch defenders of the 8 on here... not surprising though. I think it's quite obvious the 8 is slower in the 1/4 mile than a G35 coupe and a Z, if have the same transmissions on all of them. I think that's well established. To claim that the 8 has almost identical performance in a straight line is BS IMHO.

If any 8 owners live in the Seattle area, when SIR/PR opens up again for drags [probably around Feb. 04], I'd be glad to stock 8 owners to some drags there against my stock automatic Z.

I will concede that the 8 from all accounts handles better than the other 2 and has a better interior than the Z. I will also concede that the ride on the 8 is not nearly as harsh as my Z's.

Although people love to quote magazine numbers, they are all not really any use.

Many tracks are slippery, and there's others that stick very well. This will make a difference in times between the tracks.

Also, temperature, elevation, etc all play a big part in the times that people run!

Even the driver may not be launching the best or shifting fast enough in one car or the other!

Bench race some more.

Everything on rx8club in this section is starting to remind me of Superhonda.com

The 350Z is an ugly car.
If you were to get one I hope you don't get a white one,
or else you'd be driving in a friggin bar of soap.

Anyways,

Whatever rumors/horror stories you hear about the RX-8 are ALL MADE UP BY COMPETITORS LIKE NISSAN AND INFINITE.

People come up to me today and say that Mazda's engines and parts are no good.....

HELLO! RX-8 WON ENGINE OF THE YEAR HERE AND THERE AND EVERYWHERE. Not to mention all the Japanese competitions that put rotary back to life.

My Ford Escape has been back in the dealer's shop at least 4 or 5 times a year before hitting 23,000 miles while my Mazda Protege 5 is almost at 30,000 and has never even hinted at visiting the shop. Heck, I still don't even know which dealer my dad got the car from.

Get an RX-8. You can't go wrong.

The only thing more pathetic than reading this thread would be watching a 350PIG and Rx8 race in the 1/4 mile. 15.1, 14.7, 14.5, 14.0, whatever, its ALL SLOW.

Get over it.

Arguing on the internet is a lot like the special olympics .... Even if you win you are still retarded :)

http://www.verstedenpapier.nl/images/flameg3.jpg

Originally posted by SpYnalChRd81
The 350Z is an ugly car.
If you were to get one I hope you don't get a white one,
or else you'd be driving in a friggin bar of soap.

Anyways,

Whatever rumors/horror stories you hear about the RX-8 are ALL MADE UP BY COMPETITORS LIKE NISSAN AND INFINITE.
...
HELLO! RX-8 WON ENGINE OF THE YEAR HERE AND THERE AND EVERYWHERE. Not to mention all the Japanese competitions that put rotary back to life.



To each his own. I like the styling of the Z... the only part that's not so great is the rear. On the other hand, I dislike the styling of the 8 (mainly due to the suicide doors) and engine troubles enough to not buy one. The last generation of RX-7s around in the US looked better to me. I already have a Z anyhow... white isn't bad IMHO, but mine is Daytona blue.

As for rumors and all... err whatever. BTW, the Nissan VQ engine series have won Ward's Ten Best Engines award for 10 years straight. See http://ca.autos.yahoo.com/031212/11/vwrv.html along w/tons of other URLs.

Originally posted by zerobanger
The only thing more pathetic than reading this thread would be watching a 350PIG and Rx8 race in the 1/4 mile. 15.1, 14.7, 14.5, 14.0, whatever, its ALL SLOW.

Get over it.
I guess it's all relative. If the 350Z is such a "PIG", then I guess that's why it's faster in the 1/4 than the 8? Sure, it's slow compared to Ferraris and Dodge Vipers which can run in the 12s stock and both are snails compared to say professional drag racers w/their top fuel cars that run in the mid 4s @ >300 mph which are nowhere near street legal nor driveable on public roads.

But, it's fast compared to slow poke cars that run in the 17s or above. Even a guy running a low 15 has pretty handily beaten at guy running a mid 16.

Yet another wasted thread. They are two totally different cars.

If I wanted a roadster, I probably would have went s2k instead of the Z. Either way, every car discussed is a great car, and each one is a technological wonder. Cars just get better and better every years ;)

I think that when people discuss threads like this, there is a lot of opinion mixed in with fact and a lot of BS, too!

Let's remember the original thread here. RX8 or 350Z. Keep it on track ;)

I'll add to this. I have a racing friend that has a 350Z. He did bigger tires (mx's) on the track and I was on touring tires. He walked all over me ;) Well, not really that bad! But it's a faster car out of the box, and it was upgraded.

He's one of my benchmarks, and with a few mods, and absolute driving, I know that I can take him on the track.

How rediculous is this thread? V6 2 seater vs. a 4 seat 1.3L?

Get what you want. If the Z suits you, then by all means go and buy it! I see posts all the time where people buy the 8 for the handling, smooth power delivery, and the fact that it has 4 seats that adults can enjoy (and some kiddies in their seats, too!).

Which one is the better car? It depends on what YOUR requirements are! I don't see people posting up what their requirements are in a car very much. You can say car X is better all day long. That's great. But WHY are you saying that car X is better? What are YOUR requirements?

Originally posted by cwerdna
I guess it's all relative. If the 350Z is such a "PIG", then I guess that's why it's faster in the 1/4 than the 8?




Its a two seater sportscar thats slower than the car it replaced. Infact it will get smoked by any of the following cars that are 10-14 years older.

Rx-7 TT
supra TT
3000 GT VR4/Stealth




Sure, it's slow compared to Ferraris and Dodge Vipers which can run in the 12s stock and both are snails compared to say professional drag racers w/their top fuel cars that run in the mid 4s @ >300 mph which are nowhere near street legal nor driveable on public roads.




You dont have to goto dodge vipers to see how slow it is, you can compare to the older japanese cars listed above or even some of the current, let me elaborate.

S2000 ( R & T got a 13.6 on the 04)
Any LS1 Car
NEON SRT
EVO
STI


bottom line, 14's, even 14.0 which is with a seriously good driver, just plain SUCKS.




But, it's fast compared to slow poke cars that run in the 17s or above. Even a guy running a low 15 has pretty handily beaten at guy running a mid 16.

its fast compared to a 17 second car? thats brilliant, so is a miaita.

I like the 8 'cause it is more practical for me than the 350Z.

And the the 350Z was missing something very important in my own eyes. To give a hint, my 2 favourite engines are V8's and rotaries. So the Z was not even considered because of my stubborn religous engine beliefs.

I'm glad LS1's were mentioned. My previous car was a LS1 powered beast, with 300+ rwHP. After I got the 8 I went to a private LS1 drag day with all my car buddies. I could not find one stock LS1 to race against! Of all the cars I raced, I beat them all to the 60' mark and beyond (1/3 - 1/2 track) before they hauled me in. (well all of them except for a few 11 & 12 second monsters!)

But I'm still smiling. There are so many other things to take into consideratio, such a handling and braking. And I am yet to do any traditional mods - exhaust/intake/tune.

Cheers,
Hymee.

Originally posted by zerobanger
bottom line, 14's, even 14.0 which is with a seriously good driver, just plain SUCKS.
[/B]

Maybe your bottom line :D I'm going to assume magazine racing and 1/4 mile are your requirements for car discussions?

Hey, I can go to the track anytime and run a low 11 1/4 mile. And that's slow!!! Oh wait, I'M getting of topic now, lol.

Originally posted by zerobanger
Its a two seater sportscar thats slower than the car it replaced. Infact it will get smoked by any of the following cars that are 10-14 years older.

Rx-7 TT
supra TT
3000 GT VR4/Stealth

You dont have to goto dodge vipers to see how slow it is, you can compare to the older japanese cars listed above or even some of the current, let me elaborate.

S2000 ( R & T got a 13.6 on the 04)
Any LS1 Car
NEON SRT
EVO
STI


bottom line, 14's, even 14.0 which is with a seriously good driver, just plain SUCKS.


Well, gee they don't make any of the first four cars you mention anymore. Hmmm.... Sports cars have a tend to not sell very well. As for the 350Z being slower than the car it replaced, definitely not the NA version. I'm not sure compared to the twin turbo 300ZX, but it should be close (don't have stats on me, the TT had more power but weighed a lot more). Keep in mind the big problem was that the 300ZX TT was >$40K (which is a LOT of $ back in 96) and moved beyond the realm of affordability. The 350Z is something that's a lot more affordable.

The 03 S2000s were comparable in performance. The SRT-4 is a little slower than the 350Z but yeah it's a great value for the performance. Too bad Dodge reliability (esp. on the Neon) is crap. Yeah, the Evo and STi will smoke it hands down and I admit they are fantastic values.. But do you really wanna drive around a car that looks like an econobox w/a big ricer wing on it?

Originally posted by cwerdna
Well, gee they don't make any of the first four cars you mention anymore. Hmmm.... Sports cars have a tend to not sell very well. As for the 350Z being slower than the car it replaced, definitely not the NA version. I'm not sure compared to the twin turbo 300ZX, but it should be close (don't have stats on me, the TT had more power but weighed a lot more). Keep in mind the big problem was that the 300ZX TT was >$40K (which is a LOT of $ back in 96) and moved beyond the realm of affordability. The 350Z is something that's a lot more affordable.

The 03 S2000s were comparable in performance. The SRT-4 is a little slower than the 350Z but yeah it's a great value for the performance. Too bad Dodge reliability (esp. on the Neon) is crap. Yeah, the Evo and STi will smoke it hands down and I admit they are fantastic values.. But do you really wanna drive around a car that looks like an econobox w/a big ricer wing on it?


Um, the 03 SRT was a bit faster than the 350Z and the 04 SRT has even more power.

Originally posted by zerobanger
Um, the 03 SRT was a bit faster than the 350Z and the 04 SRT has even more power.
What's the best 1/4 mile on an 03 stock SRT-4? I've seen C&D's figure is 14.1. I'm not saying their's is the gospel truth, but people have achieved better on stock 350Zs.

How about an 04?

Originally posted by cwerdna
What's the best 1/4 mile on an 03 stock SRT-4? I've seen C&D's figure is 14.1. I'm not saying their's is the gospel truth, but people have achieved better on stock 350Zs.

How about an 04?

scc got 13.7. I have not seen tests for the 04 yet.

i am buying one next month, but i really don't like the idea that my brother is getting smoke in Dallas from those Z, can we just stop saying that they will smoke us and start thinking in what we can do to beat them...:)...

Like it or not the SRT4 is fast.

But the rear passengers STILL have to roll down their windows.

Originally posted by areitu
Like it or not the SRT4 is fast.

But the rear passengers STILL have to roll down their windows.

The dodge is very fast! I have a friend that bought a new one for like 18.5 OTD so it was a good deal for him.

You should see them at autox, they just spin first AND second all the time!

If only it was a RWD car! I think the topic of this post should involve RWD somewhere.

I bought the RX8 because you can't find a RWD car new for the value of the 8. Sure the power is less than some other cars, but you have ultimate control over the rear end ;)

Forget FWD cars for me for now on, it's good to be back in a RWD car, but it does take more skill to drive on at the limits!

BTW,

I drove an Rx-8 yesterday and was AMAZED by how it drove, what an AMAZING Machine. Anyone that disses the rx-8 needs to drive it. You cant drive this car and not love it.

Originally posted by zerobanger
BTW,

I drove an Rx-8 yesterday and was AMAZED by how it drove, what an AMAZING Machine. Anyone that disses the rx-8 needs to drive it. You cant drive this car and not love it.


Well put! Enough of the "magazine" racing already@!!!!

Originally posted by areitu
Like it or not the SRT4 is fast.

But the rear passengers STILL have to roll down their windows.


If an SRT-4 ever wants to race you just roll down your rear windows while driving and give them a big grin while they speed off in anger :D

Originally posted by canzoomer
TThe crank position sensor is internal to the engine.
NOT an hours job.
It is also the SECOND attempt to fix this same problem!
To resurface an old thread, my 02 Maxima turned out to be affected (notice came in the mail despite a call to NNA saying my car wasn't affected).

It took the dealer a little over an hour to do it (I waited while it was done). The PDF of the procedure is at http://www.harjothundal.com/maximaorg/enginesensor3.pdf. The sensors are NOT internal. Also, if you look at the end, you'll notice that the billing time for the job is 0.5-0.8 hours depending on the car.

the rx7 was a little prone to overheating....they fixed that problem with the new rx8. besides, the looks of the rx8 are WAY better than the z. also (honestly) the stereo system in the z sounds like it is underwater and the stock suspension is pretty damn horrible.

I've had both cars and I really, really like both. I live in LA and am not so great with stick, so I'm comparing auto Touring Z to auto 8, so the disparity is bigger than if the 8 were a stick. (if I had two cars, I'd get it in stick for weekends but can only afford one).

Now that I have the 8, I kind of miss the Z (switched because the dealer screwed up on the title of the Z) but the 8 is a really great car. Both are very fun to drive. Z for its torque and the 8 for its responsive steering. Z handles very well but the 8 "feels" lighter" and easier to whip around. 8 is definitely more practical and you never know if you're going to need that space.

I'd be great to have both; Still cost less than a Porsche :)

This subject has been beaten to death. Do a search.

that is why i want rx8.. back seats, and high reving ROTARY ;).

but then i hear all these crazy rumors about engine blowining, bla bla bla.... scares me to get ione.



My engine blew...they replaced it....if I had the chance to do it all over again, I'd still get the RX8.

I try and find excuses to get out and drive it.

I have an Audi and I love the ride and handling of my Audi - nothing beats the AWD in winter. The ride of the 350Z may not be great if you are used to the Audi handling and ride. That's why I choose an RX8 (I still have my Audi allroad with the RX8 as my alternate ride). If you want speed, 350Z will give you a split second faster ... but I would not give up the ride and great handling of the RX8.

This subject has been beaten to death. Do a search.


Ummm you're not really this clueless are you Doug? This thread is nearly a year old, obviously someone DID do a search... That or someone types REALLY slow :p

The Z is a better looking car.
The 8 is a better car.

I think that the rx-8 is way better looking than the Z, but dont get me wrong, I love the 350Z too.

Who brought this thread back?

budebaker

Ummm you're not really this clueless are you Doug? This thread is nearly a year old, obviously someone DID do a search... That or someone types REALLY slow :p


BAWHHHHHH...Good one. :D :p

So what did you get??? The 8 or the Z?

- Irish :cool:

I drove an 03 350z with the vdc system for 2 years. The car handles great, but is heavy as hell, and is a bulldog of a car. It lacks the sophistication and finesse of an rx-8. If I were to choose between the two cars,...i'd stick to the RX-8! It's sleek, the engine has a great hummm rather than a throaty gurgle farting burp of the z. that's just my opinion.

I like mushrooms on my pizza.

I drove an 03 350z with the vdc system for 2 years. The car handles great, but is heavy as hell, and is a bulldog of a car. It lacks the sophistication and finesse of an rx-8. If I were to choose between the two cars,...i'd stick to the RX-8! It's sleek, the engine has a great hummm rather than a throaty gurgle farting burp of the z. that's just my opinion.

Your opinion is a year too late. Nobody gives a sh!t anymore. Let this freaking thread DIE already!

Your opinion is a year too late. Nobody gives a sh!t anymore. Let this freaking thread DIE already!
That's funny. It's especially funny because you're assuming someone cares what you have to say.

FYI, the point of a forum is to post your thoughts on various subjects. He chose to post here rather than perhaps starting another thread. To which, I am sure, you would have responded: "Do a search you stupid noob"

Hawaiian pizzas are good also.

Who the heck brought this back up and why!!

That's funny. It's especially funny because you're assuming someone cares what you have to say.

Obviously you care :rolleyes:.

I think I'm going to Subway today for lunch...hopefully there's no finger in my sub.

http://img211.echo.cx/img211/2344/waaambulance0vj.jpg