Ok my first post goes like this..I bought my winning blue RX8 on Oct.12 after selling my wife on the fact that indeed our kids (9) and (2) will fit in the back..for now. Anyways I bought a auto (ouch) so we can split the driving as I commute 75 miles a day. The car was great! Turned a lot of heads and even impressed me with it's pick-up.
So we go on vacation (Cabo) and when we get back my baby is in the garage just begging me to drive it. So zoom zoom I go. Next morning my wife had left for work in it and I see a small drop of coolent in the garage floor. As I looked closer I began to see more small drops of coolent only they were older and more dried up. Hmmmm so I make a call to my dealer last monday and they can't fit me in until Nov. 10 so I call another dealer and they get me in today (friday). I drive off in my Honda Civic wait for the call. 10:00 am I get "the call" "Um Mr. Campbell I have some bad news." "Ok fire away" I say thinking they need it over night (I wish). "Mr.Campbell you are going to need a NEW engine." He said the seals are bad in the engine and the coolent is leaking from there. Car has 1,200 miles. Min 2 weeks to get motor and fix.
I will make the first payment on this thing with a freaking Honda in the garage. Bull!! Here's my list of questions and/or thought's. Would appreacite any feedback..
1. Any chance on Mazda stepping up and extending the warranty?
2. Who and How do I get in contact with "the one" who can decide on this issue?
3. I will be the ginnie pig for some tech to install their first RX8 motor.
4. Dealer said the car will be sitting outside the entire time it is there ( 2 weeks).

Thanks for the help!

1. Much doubt as to extending the warranty.
2. Call MNAO if you need additional info or have additional questions.
3. It will take longer for that person to get the engine in, but it will be fine.
4. Get a car cover.

Sorry to hear about your loss.

Magnesium,
thanks I just hope this will be the only issue I have.. I'm going to speak with the service tech who is the RX7 specialist in Arizona and hope he is helpful.

I got my engine replaced- took about 2.5 weeks. New engine is faster and has better gas mileage. Sorry to hear about this- sounds like a few engines are getting replaced. While mine was being replaced, I tried to think of another car I would like, and there is no other. I love this car in spite of issues.

My wife noticed last week that my RX-8 is leaking coolant as well. I have about 4500 miles on it. I made an appointment with my dealer to have it looked at tomorrow.

it seems like this issue is becoming more and more prevalent.

I would ask the dealer to supply you with an RX-8 loaner car and a car cover for your 8 while it is awaiting its transplant.

If the dealer refuses, I would take the issue up with MNAO. They seem to be fairly helpful when it comes to major RX-8 issues like this.

Mike

Originally posted by 94se7en
I would ask the dealer to supply you with an RX-8 loaner car and a car cover for your 8 while it is awaiting its transplant.

If the dealer refuses, I would take the issue up with MNAO. They seem to be fairly helpful when it comes to major RX-8 issues like this.

Mike

I had the same idea. If it turns out I need a new engine, there's no way I'm going to be driving an econobox while my hitherto pampered car bakes neglected in the sun.

Ok my first post goes like this..I bought my winning blue RX8 on Oct.12 after selling my wife...

Heh, this quote can look bad when taken out of context.

Are they sending the old engine back to Japan?

My BS alarm is going off here. The engine block shouldn't leak coolant. If a coolant seal inside the engine is going bad, you should see blue/green smoke at startup & driving right ?

Dripping coolant should only be from hoses, pump, or the radiator.

The coolant can leak through the bolts holding the assembly together. Different "O" rings than the famous failing ones.

BTW, my friends is sitting 150 km away waiting for his replacement engine. We think his is a stationary bearing failure (very rough running - as in "how soon should I run from the explosion" ;-). The engines will be going back to Japan for evaluation.

Originally posted by RX-8 friend
The coolant can leak through the bolts holding the assembly together. Different "O" rings than the famous failing ones.


Yes. I was explaining the problem to a coworker at lunch and I think I have a pretty good metaphor: The Renesis is a Big Mac (tm)

rotor housings: two all beef patties
engine end and middle pieces: the buns
coolant passages: toothpicks
engine seals: cheese
rotors: pickles
coolant: special sauce.

This allows me to explain the problem as one of those messy, drippy hamburgers. :eek:

I love the analogy!

OK, I just got mine back yesterday after getting the engine replaced (920 miles, coolant leak as first/only symptom). :( It took 3.5 weeks (OK, the last .5 was to replace a piece of door trim). During that time, the dealer put 80 miles on it in 'test drives'. I don't really begrudge that, although it seems extreme (mostly 'cause the left me with only fumes in my tank).

It sounds/runs great now. :) I'll report later on fuel economy deltas (it had so far averaged 16.8 mpg for the first 780 miles).

This was the only engine that dealer has replaced, they took considerably longer than their norm (according to the guy who did it), but were quite proud of their work - I think they were simply more careful because it was their first. I was fortunate to get a complete unit - including new (baffles included) oil pan, clutch and even wiring harness.

They also related to me that after everything was put back together and they started it for the first time, it sounded great but the CEL came on. They called home and found out that was to be expected - apparantly they have to reprogram the ECU to understand the engine has been changed, and to expect readings (not sure what those readings are) to be different with a new engine.

I'm nervous, I'll check the garage floor daily, but I am happy to have my baby back! :)

Thanks, waynesworld. I haven't been without my baby for 18 hours and I'm already emotionally weak. Thank Ghod my wife understands. ;) The rental car will surely forgive my antipathy...

I sure hope I don't have to wait 3 weeks (I may be acting like an automotive-codependent.... she hasn't even been diagnosed, yet.)

I've been rather anal about logging my mileage since Day 0, so I'll notice any performance changes objectively and subjectively. Until the leak appeared, I've not had a single solid complaint w/ the car (apparently my "honeymoon" is a two month affair.)

Originally posted by ectomort
I had the same idea. If it turns out I need a new engine, there's no way I'm going to be driving an econobox while my hitherto pampered car bakes neglected in the sun.
The dealer made arrangements with Enterprize car rentals.
While waiting for my car back I am driving a Jeep Cherokee, loaded. Practical and comfortable for our local climate.

It was no surprise when my dealer called this morning to tell me that I am getting a new engine (they said by Friday.) Diagnosis: engine seal failure. I think MNAO has calculated the expected failure rate for engine seals and has a supply of replacement engines on hand.

My engine is in!! They said a couple of days. Talked to "Bruce " District rep. over at Mazda and he was kind enough to upgrade the civic through Hertz. Only one problem, I got to Hertz late last night and they were out of cars. Even though the asst. Mgr. at Hertz was called and told I would be down. No biggie, I guess, but I will call Bruce back and ask for some sort of compansation for this motor issue. Extended warr. would be nice!
ectomort- Are you going to push the issue and how's your rental?

I guess I got lucky with the rental - it was the dealer's loaded Tribute with 500 miles on it (and their personalized plate).

How do I get in touch with MNAO? I only have a customer service number. I want to ask for an extended warranty (or even a set of fender strakes!).

Originally posted by RX GR8T
My engine is in!! They said a couple of days. Talked to "Bruce " District rep. over at Mazda and he was kind enough to upgrade the civic through Hertz.
....
Extended warr. would be nice!
ectomort- Are you going to push the issue and how's your rental?

Congrats, RX GR8T.

I bought the extended warranty when I bought my car (and prolly paid too much, I just wanted to get out of the dealership and DRIVE) so I'm not sure what to ask for. Of course, I would like to get some kind of extension or compensation, though. I'm really not looking forward to having to hold back and break in another engine. Wotta royal pain.

As for rental cars, yesterday Enterprise and Marina Mazda (of Capitola CA) put me in a Ford Focus. :mad: I swear it almost made me puke. Today, I moaned enough to get an upgrade (Hyundai Elantra) but not it's enough of an upgrade for me to actually be grateful. ;)

I think I'll start a poll to see how many owners have had the coolant leak/engine replace problem.

I think I'll start a poll to see how many owners have had the coolant leak/engine replace problem. [/B]

I started 1 a few days ago in the performance section. it should probably be in tech not come to think about it..

Hey guys,

sorry to hear about your problems with the 8. I might be jinxing myself by saying that i have had no problems with my 8. But it makes me a little nervous about the problems anyway. What telltale signs are there for the coolant leak other than checking under the car? rough idle? low power? obviously the temperature guage?

thanks for any information, and good luck with the car.


santino

Santino- I ONLY saw a small droplet of coolant in my garage by chance, my wife was driving it and I happened to look down when I left in the morning. Very small, size of a nickel maybe. car ran gr8t. Idle was fine. Beleive it or not the temp gadge was fine too. That's why I figured it was a small drop from a loose clamp or nut. But I will say on the morning I took it in the radiator light came on and off a few times. That was the first I'd seen it.
On another note I talked to the GURU of RX7's in Arizona today. He is the guy working on my car. This will be the first 8 he has done, but has done several 7's and even had a few old motors sitting around. So he told me about a few things that I found interesting. Spark plugs should be changed every 30,000 or SOONER ( know it's in the manual but here's my point) and they only cost $130.00 EACH!! He said first set is covered under warrenty but after that watch out. He showed me right where it was leaking. Between the housings is a o-ring that sets in there. Mazda told him they believe it is a milling issue. The other info I got made me a little nervous. He said that he has to drop the tranny then the suspension in order to get motor out. But he doesn't have spec's for suspension. I guess he will get from Mazda. At this point I was getting a headache and went to work.

Thanks for the heads up GR8T....

I don't blame you in getting that headache. I have had my share of headaches...I have an FD. Got the motor rebuilt, but now it is stronger than ever. Hopefully your car will do the same thing. After reading this thread, I am constantly checking the underneath my 8. better safe than sorry i guess.

take care

santino

Well Guys got the car back over the weekend and all seems well. I will be driving it like a old lady for awhile. They put a small nick in pass door that is going to get fixed Tuesday. other than that I things look ok. Only put on 20 miles while it was there. It's nice to have her back. I should hear back from Mazda monday.I'm forcing the extended warranty issue. I'm the first in Arizona to have a motor go bad and I hope that want to "make things right". We will see. Tech said engine went in MUCH easier than the RX&'s do. Didn't have to take apart the suspension either. Wish me luck.

Good luck man, and congrats on getting your baby back. I know how it feels to be without one's pride and joy.

Man...all of this talk is making me skeptical about picking up an 8 in a couple of months...think the new ones coming in from Japan will have the problem resolved?

I have one of the first ones made ... i have no issues with my 8.

I picked up mine on the 29th of july

i was just wondering if any one has had there gauge cluster disasembled or out of the car yet. the reason i am wondering is becouse on the 7's there is a switch on the odomitor. its called a 20,000 mile switch. it runs the car ritch and at a "safe" timming set till 20,000 miles for "proper" engine break-in. i was wondering if any one has hit that milage yet and if you have have you had a noticable increase in power?

ej

Baahahaha!!! LOL... A 20,000 mile switch? Baahahaha!!!!

Originally posted by islandsoon
Baahahaha!!! LOL... A 20,000 mile switch? Baahahaha!!!!
The FD really does have a 20k mile switch. There are inspection instructions for it in the RX-7 shop manual.

No problems with my 8 either.

Hmmm, so it took 8 days to get your engine completely replaced? That's not too bad...

Originally posted by Rick
The FD really does have a 20k mile switch. There are inspection instructions for it in the RX-7 shop manual.
can you provide for the location of this instruction in the shop manual...

Originally posted by vaughnc
My BS alarm is going off here. The engine block shouldn't leak coolant. If a coolant seal inside the engine is going bad, you should see blue/green smoke at startup & driving right ?

Dripping coolant should only be from hoses, pump, or the radiator.

if the seal the dealership was referrin to was a coolant seal failure....
coolant entry into the combustion area will produce thick white smoke upon startup..
i'm more than willing to say RX GR8T ...that with the inexperience of the dealership.. ..
that theyve simply took the easier route of stating motor replacement....
have you asked how it was diagnosed per chance..

Originally posted by amp
can you provide for the location of this instruction in the shop manual...

F-175

I got my car back last night. It took the shop 8 days to replace the engine (3 to get it from southern California.) So now I'm breaking in the new one and I've started a separate mileage log for "Engine B."

The repair manifest diagnoses the problem as "coolant leak at rear rotor housing at the stationary gear housing."

Originally posted by ectomort
I got my car back last night. It took the shop 8 days to replace the engine (3 to get it from southern California.) So now I'm breaking in the new one and I've started a separate mileage log for "Engine B."

The repair manifest diagnoses the problem as "coolant leak at rear rotor housing at the stationary gear housing."

How was the quality of their work? Engine look clean? Everything running well?

what a crock of shit, I suggest returning it

Originally posted by islandsoon
Baahahaha!!! LOL... A 20,000 mile switch? Baahahaha!!!!

From page F-175.. I'm a bit surprised how quickly folks jump to ridicule something they don't know anything about...

Also the FC rx7's have a 20k mile switch also (page F2-84) so it's likely the rx8 could have a similar setup.

You guys should give up on ford products and buy a real car like an mr2.

Originally posted by ectomort
Yes. I was explaining the problem to a coworker at lunch and I think I have a pretty good metaphor: The Renesis is a Big Mac (tm)

rotor housings: two all beef patties
engine end and middle pieces: the buns
coolant passages: toothpicks
engine seals: cheese
rotors: pickles
coolant: special sauce.

This allows me to explain the problem as one of those messy, drippy hamburgers. :eek:

Hahaha, that is great, I love the analogy, it really is a big mac.

How many of you that have had engine problems have automatic transmisions? I want to know if there may be some corralation (sp) becuase they are diffrent from the manual versions.

Originally posted by sferrett
From page F-175.. I'm a bit surprised how quickly folks jump to ridicule something they don't know anything about...
its on f189 in my shop manual..
its not ridicule on my part.. just seeking info..
havin gone through 4 fds and an fc.. im curious as ive never actually understood the function of the mileage switch stated in the manual..
im lookin for where it actually explains its purpose and substantiate these fuel safe mode statements..

Originally posted by Efini 8
what a crock of shit, I suggest returning it

Lol...Damn car.

Originally posted by 24-7_420
You guys should give up on ford products and buy a real car like an mr2.

Cool...now where do I stick the kids and groceries?

are they selling the blown Renesis engine back?

I'd like to try one on my FD :)

You guys should give up on ford products and buy a real car like an mr2.

Guess what, einstein, the RX8 is entirely NOT a Ford product. If you are trying to say that it is like the B4000 and the Ford Ranger, go do your homework before posting.

Ford might have made certain models for Mazda in the US in the past, but the 8 is entirely it's own model, and built on decades of racing development.

MR2? Maybe a twin turbo, otherwise, get in the granny lane :D Now if you would have said Supra, that might have shown an ounce of intelligence.

Anyway, all this talk about engines and leaky coolant has me freaked. I guess I'll put some cardboard underneath for a week and see what happens. I noticed also that my gas mileage is hardly over 18 on the highway. I'm wondering if thats a sign that I might have one of the 'bad' engines?

Originally posted by ectomort
I got my car back last night. It took the shop 8 days to replace the engine (3 to get it from southern California.) So now I'm breaking in the new one and I've started a separate mileage log for "Engine B."

The repair manifest diagnoses the problem as "coolant leak at rear rotor housing at the stationary gear housing."

Hmmm - there are no coolant passages near the Stationary Gear, it is only oil. It would be more likely that it was from a thru bolt or one of the large water control rings.

Do you think you could find out for us?

Also - does anyone know if this was an issue with materials in the first batch of RX-8's? as I believe there were a few issues here and there.

Thanks.

Originally posted by -=Zeqs=-
How was the quality of their work? Engine look clean? Everything running well?

I think the quality of the engine work is fine (mine was the first engine replacement in an 8 that the mechanic had done.) It's clean in there, from what I can see. The new engine idles a little differently than my original, and the shift points on 1st and 2nd gear are a little different. I'm hoping it smooths out a little. I'll give it some time before I take it back to the shop for that.

I'm still on the 2nd tank of gas, so it's hard to say if there's a change in fuel economy (I was getting 18-20 with the original engine.)

Originally posted by 9-K Rever
How many of you that have had engine problems have automatic transmisions? I want to know if there may be some corralation (sp) becuase they are diffrent from the manual versions.

Mine is a manual transmission.

OK... let me get this straight. In this one thread alone there are 3 people that have had to get their engine replaced?! What's up with that?

I can understand many new owners willing to overlook little annoyances due to the ego-pumping, head-turning effect that this car has. But dudes and dudettes, we're talking about replacing the engine not a glove compartment latch here.

have any of you called MNAO and asked the total amount of replaced 8 engines? From this board alone, I've heard of 6. Is that accurate?

I believe Canzoomer had collected some data from a Mazda/Canada source stating that there were approximately 60 cases in North America. That data is a few weeks old, though, prior to the examples posted here.

I'm uncertain as to the "normal" engine failure rates for high performance engines (or other major drivetrain components -- e.g., several 350Z drivers on My350Z.com reported having to replace their transmissions) during a first-year run. I believe to date there have been about 10K RX8's sold in North America.

FWIW, I still plan on purchasing one of these vehicles in a few months.

Originally posted by JaegerNH

I can understand many new owners willing to overlook little annoyances due to the ego-pumping, head-turning effect that this car has. But dudes and dudettes, we're talking about replacing the engine not a glove compartment latch here.

Disclaimer: I'm one of those ecstatic owners who feels that Mazda has done a great job supporting it's customers (I received the $500 credit and free service package, which biases me a tad.)

I'm glad they replaced the whole engine unit... it allows Mazda to fully analyze the failure, and I know I have a complete, factory assembled engine. If Canzoomer/SpacerX's speculation about the failure rates is true, only 0.6% of the engines are having this problem. Sounds like an incidental manufacturing problem to me; rather than a design defect.

SpacerX, fwiw, I've had the car for 2.5 months and I totally love it... driving it, looking at it, hearing it. My wife took it out the other day to run an errand (she doesn't drive it often) and came back beaming, "your car is so fun!" Good luck, future owner, you won't be sorry.

Current 88 Rx7 Owner Here. Seems like the Rx8 has a lot of problems that need to be worked out of it. I love the Rx8 but reading on the problems it has so far. for a 30,000 dollar car.... hm. I dunno. seems like Ill be paying more then 30,000 down the road on repairs.


Justin

Originally posted by ectomort
Disclaimer: I'm one of those ecstatic owners who feels that Mazda has done a great job supporting it's customers (I received the $500 credit and free service package, which biases me a tad.)

I'm glad they replaced the whole engine unit... it allows Mazda to fully analyze the failure, and I know I have a complete, factory assembled engine. If Canzoomer/SpacerX's speculation about the failure rates is true, only 0.6% of the engines are having this problem. Sounds like an incidental manufacturing problem to me; rather than a design defect.

SpacerX, fwiw, I've had the car for 2.5 months and I totally love it... driving it, looking at it, hearing it. My wife took it out the other day to run an errand (she doesn't drive it often) and came back beaming, "your car is so fun!" Good luck, future owner, you won't be sorry.

Rojr that, Ecto. I've been test driving lots of vehicles for the past year or so -- going to retire my trusty Probe GT after 11 years of outstanding service (giving it to my mom, actually -- not worth it to try and trade-in). The RX8 by far and away meets my expectations for a modern, exciting, and unconventional sportscar. Really the same thing that attracted me to the PGT. It's a very balanced design. Concur with your assessment: my impression of the issues is that they are "first-year blues," versus fundamental design flaws.

BTW, (off-topic) I'm also retiring my Mac of 8 years to get a new one soon -- probably one of the new 15" Powerbooks...

Ciao!
Darren

Originally posted by ViperDude152
I dunno. seems like Ill be paying more then 30,000 down the road on repairs.


I won't. Regardless of what happens, Mazda has given me and other owners who purchased the car before Sept. 26th free servicing during the first 4 years/40K miles. Add an extended warranty and that means the first 10 years/100K miles is worry free for me. All I pay for is gas, tires, and accessories. :D

I know everyone doesn't have these perqs, but from what I've seen, Mazda is committed to satisfying it's customers.

Originally posted by SpacerX

BTW, (off-topic) I'm also retiring my Mac of 8 years to get a new one soon -- probably one of the new 15" Powerbooks...


Slick! You'll have two great new rides soon. Congrats. The new PowerBooks rock (and so does Panther.) I drive a 15" TiBook myself at home (and a dual 2GHz G5 at work.)

Originally posted by ectomort
I think the quality of the engine work is fine (mine was the first engine replacement in an 8 that the mechanic had done.) It's clean in there, from what I can see. The new engine idles a little differently than my original, and the shift points on 1st and 2nd gear are a little different. I'm hoping it smooths out a little. I'll give it some time before I take it back to the shop for that.

I'm still on the 2nd tank of gas, so it's hard to say if there's a change in fuel economy (I was getting 18-20 with the original engine.)

Hmm...well, the old belief is that not every engine is created equally...just like no two cars of the same model are exactly the same. Over all though, is it responsive?

Originally posted by ViperDude152
Current 88 Rx7 Owner Here. Seems like the Rx8 has a lot of problems that need to be worked out of it. I love the Rx8 but reading on the problems it has so far. for a 30,000 dollar car.... hm. I dunno. seems like Ill be paying more then 30,000 down the road on repairs.


Justin

? 30,000 on warranties?

Another thread with similar discussion located HERE (http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15261&perpage=40&pagenumber=1)

For those on this thread in the same boat as me (currently "testing the waters"), please allow me to re-post from the other thread:

" I'm also in the market (timeframe for purchase a few months from now). I continue to be impressed with the design characteristics of the RX8, compared to the conventional designs that define the current offerings from other makes. Everything about the design seems much more optimal, either for interior space and utility, or for the sportscar handling and performance. To say nothing of the unique styling. The only other vehicle I currently see making as bold a statement is perhaps the Infiniti FX. Everything else seems pretty boring...

"I'm not too concerned with the first-year model issues noted above. I don't see them precluding my picking one up in a few months."

Ciao!
Darren

Originally posted by ectomort
I'm glad they replaced the whole engine unit... it allows Mazda to fully analyze the failure, and I know I have a complete, factory assembled engine. If Canzoomer/SpacerX's [i]speculation about the failure rates is true, only 0.6% of the engines are having this problem. Sounds like an incidental manufacturing problem to me; rather than a design defect.


I agree. Firstly if it is a design defect, we would see more failures, and a number of them failing more gradually.
This entirely sounds like a limited number of failures probably cause by a limited number of some bad part.

Secondly, they are taking the right approach in changing out the whole assembly, which leaves one to think that they too feel there is something specifically wrong with a handful of cars.