Some good news:

In the last 2 weeks we transferred our tuning and testing to completely on the road.
I bought and installed a new fuel/air broadband sensor and a very nice display/logging device for it.
Very accurate and very portable
If anyone is interested, see:
http://www.lambdaboy.com/product.html

We also installed Pyrometers before and after the first catalytic converter so we could log exhaust temps on the fly. We confirmed that the maps we are using are safe for the catalytic converters.
Max temerature is 1600F on stock seetup, and with our final fuel/air map it does not exxceed that temp, but does get to it a bit sooner.

Lastly, we installed a GTEch pro in the last few days and re-did our performance runs with the maps we have derived for fuel/air and ignition. 25HP with a quite safe and mild fuel/air map.
7-12HP gain in the midrange 4000-6000 rpm zone
25HP gain at 6000-9000, with peak at 8500rpm.

So we are now finalized and will be putting out controllers in 2 weeks. Just waiting for a large batch of the connectors needed to plug in the ECU sockets.

Bad news:
2 nights ago, while driving home on the highway at 2:00 a.m. and at 130kmh, I got a sudden engien stumble, a blinking check engine light, and it started running REALLY rough.
I limped 20 miles to the next town, parked it, got a room.
Next day it was tough to start, but i managed and got it to a shop. We checked ignition, etc., but saw no obvious problems.
Next time we started it we had to fight to get it to run, and there was a horrible rattling sound, like a badly tuned cold diesel engine.

Called Mazda Roadside Assistance, got it towed to the local dealership.

Next day the diagnosis came down from Mazda:
Failure of oil injection system, resulting in seized side seals on one rotor.
Naturally I was quite relieved as I worried I had possibly hurt my engine by testing.
In fact the failure mode is unrelated.
Old engine being shipped to Japan, and I am told that in Canda there are now 6 of this problem and result.

New engine is now on the way from Japan under warranty.
So, my car is parked at the dealers for the next while.

Damn!

Damn is right! Keep up the good work.

I dont know whether to be more pleased about the good news than I am worried about the bad news!

Heh. Talk about a pickle. Good stuff coming from zoomer, bad shit happening to engines.

Hmmm...

At least nobody can say that owning the car isnt exciting!

Tough break on the engine, CZ. At least it's a known problem unrelated to the tinkering... Weird phenomenon, though. I hope it's not a trend.

I can only imagine what you must've been feeling, sweating it out waiting for the diagnosis to come back... Sounds like there will be a happy ending to the story, though:D

As always, excellent news on the tuning front. Thanx again for all your dilligence and effort.

Originally posted by SpacerX
Tough break on the engine, CZ. At least it's a known problem unrelated to the tinkering... Weird phenomenon, though. I hope it's not a trend.

I can only imagine what you must've been feeling, sweating it out waiting for the diagnosis to come back... Sounds like there will be a happy ending to the story, though:D

As always, excellent news on the tuning front. Thanx again for all your dilligence and effort.

Stress? What stress?

Yeah, sweating bullets is pretty close.

At least a buddy of mine has new Renesis blocks sitting in his shop in Calgary.

As for happy endings, I will now get to break in a new engine, and we are putting ceramic apex seals in it, so I can break in with those installed.

You are most welcome. It has been a wild and fun ride so far.

I'm a bit confused, were you running a remapped ECU in the car at the time of failure?

No, that is the ironic part.
We had pulled the gear out a couple of days before, as we have finished testing, and we need to install this on our two"beta testers" cars, and i only have a limited number of the connectors.

Lucky you did pull out the gear, or they might have pulled your warrenty.

Is this 25hp gain "to the wheel"?

When will we see the maps available to the public for those of us with cars with open exhaust? 25hp is nice, but I want the 50hp you spoke about earlier. :)

Originally posted by DefBringer
Is this 25hp gain "to the wheel"?

When will we see the maps available to the public for those of us with cars with open exhaust? 25hp is nice, but I want the 50hp you spoke about earlier. :)
25HP is measured by Mustang dyno and by GTech Pro.
If you want 50, be prepared to buy a midpipe to eliminate your catalytic converters, and to be sure to always run good octane gas. In other words buy your gas where you can count on the 91 or better number to be safe.

To do 50HP gain you need fuel/air maps, and about 3+ degrees of advance.

On a 10:1 engine that is quite feasible, but makes good fuel mandatory.
You will also be running exhaust temps peaking at around 1900+ degrees F, so cats will last about a day.

hmmmmmm thats some interesting news.
damn lucky you pulled the gear too
________
Itunes Gift Cards (http://bestfreegiftcard.com/itunes-gift-cards/)

That's odd that an OMP failure would result in damage to a side seal. I was under the impression that the OMP was used to lubricate the insides of the apex seals, because the combusion chambers on a rotary are static, unlike a piston. I would think that low oil pressure from the main pump would result in damage to a side seal, or a bearing, etc.

Unrelated to the engine failure, aren't ceramic seals shorter lived than their cast iron counterparts?

Originally posted by SA22C
That's odd that an OMP failure would result in damage to a side seal. I was under the impression that the OMP was used to lubricate the insides of the apex seals, because the combusion chambers on a rotary are static, unlike a piston. I would think that low oil pressure from the main pump would result in damage to a side seal, or a bearing, etc.

Unrelated to the engine failure, aren't ceramic seals shorter lived than their cast iron counterparts?
I am simply quoting what Mazda Canada have told me. I am not going to be able to take the engine apart to inspect it myself, unfortunately.

Ceramat seals are similar life to the iron apex seals Mazda uses.
Pure ceramic are much harder and tougher.
And last longer.
Adam uses these in racing engines, and they do not seem to wear out.

Its funny, 2 weeks ago I started mine in the garage and heard a burring whir sound (diferent than that purr) and just let it run. for a bit. I drove it and the sound went away after about 2-3 min. That was at around 3000 miles. I have also noted that the engine is using less oil.

sheesh......i thought this damn car was suppose to be reliable. What's up with the enginge failures.

Originally posted by rx7 rage
sheesh......i thought this damn car was suppose to be reliable. What's up with the enginge failures.


There haven't been any more than in any other first run car. It's pretty standard that some are going to be not quite right.

off topic: elara, is that a large roach next to your car?

Originally posted by miata2rx8
off topic: elara, is that a large roach next to your car?

No, it's a small beetle that snuck into the picture. I enlarged it with photoshop because it struck me as funny. The original is here (http://www.elysianplains.com/elaras8/preview/frontairdam2.JPG) :)

Originally posted by miata2rx8
off topic: elara, is that a large roach next to your car?

It's an apex seal from a FD :D

I don't know... if Canzoomer is correct and nearly 60 engines have been replaced that's out of the ordinary. I can't think of many others cars that have had engines with under 10k miles replaced like that other than maybe other rotaries. I'm sure there are some but I can't think of any off the top of my head. I know this may draw a lot of flames but please give me a break as I'm just expressing my opinion... The Rotary has always seemed like a much better concept than it is an application. <dons his flame retardent suit>

Out of how many cars is that? I don't even own an RX-8, but when you say something is out of the ordinary, you have to compare it to something. It seems to me that mazda is replacing a lot of these engines to make a complete study of the problem, which is pretty admirable that they're taking the hit financially to provide a quality product. It also means that they might have it fixed by the time I can buy one :)

I know that where I work that certain parts are flagged to be returned if a warranty claim is made. This gives us a chance to look at the item, do failure analysis and risk assessment. This is especially true when a new product is released so it doesn't surprise me that engines are just being replaced and the damaged ones are being shipped back to Mazda.

Originally posted by IkeWRX
I don't know... if Canzoomer is correct and nearly 60 engines have been replaced that's out of the ordinary. I can't think of many others cars that have had engines with under 10k miles replaced like that other than maybe other rotaries.

Where did you get 60?!!

Originally posted by canzoomer
I am told that in Canada there are now 6 of this problem and result.

Other engines - how about the BMW S54, used in the 01+ M3 and M Roadster/Coupe? There's been quite a few of those blow up early in their lives. Also, the Honda S2000 has had some problems with early engine failures. Those are just off the top of my head...

Regards,
Gordon

Not good! I've got 2700 miles on my car and now I've got one more thing to worry about.

Originally posted by Gord96BRG
Where did you get 60?!!



Other engines - how about the BMW S54, used in the 01+ M3 and M Roadster/Coupe? There's been quite a few of those blow up early in their lives. Also, the Honda S2000 has had some problems with early engine failures. Those are just off the top of my head...

Regards,
Gordon


It was Canzoomers number so ask him :) I've heard the problems with the M3 but I'm not sure how common it is but never heard the S2K problems. Who knows, maybe it's more common than I realize on newly introduced engines. If Canzoomer is correct with the 60 that puts it at about 1 per 100 that have been sold thus far considering they are awaiting more from Japan (again according to Canzoomer). Not a huge number but we're talking cars that haven't even cracked 10k miles yet.

Peter, I wouldn't worry about it since it's not going to do any good, just enjoy the car.

Ike

Just read old posts in any of the forums for other cars. You'll see lots of random complaints. I've been mostly looking at the Evo and Sti as alternatives (now I'm stuck on the 8). I've seen a few complaints about the clutch and brakes on the Evo in their forums. There are only a limited number of Evo's that are going to be sent to the US, whereas the 8 will be available in much larger numbers. I also remember the WRX having a few complaints in the forums in the first. I also heard about M3's having their share of problems.

I think you'll find there's no new model that's immune from random problems in the first year, especially in a forum where you'll hear about every kind of problem. It makes it seem worse than it is because nobody writes posts titled, "Made it safely back home from work again without any car issues."

Originally posted by IkeWRX
It was Canzoomers number so ask him :) I've heard the problems with the M3 but I'm not sure how common it is but never heard the S2K problems. Who knows, maybe it's more common than I realize on newly introduced engines. If Canzoomer is correct with the 60 that puts it at about 1 per 100 that have been sold thus far considering they are awaiting more from Japan (again according to Canzoomer). Not a huge number but we're talking cars that haven't even cracked 10k miles yet.

Peter, I wouldn't worry about it since it's not going to do any good, just enjoy the car.

Ike

Ike, I still don't see where you're getting 60- I only see the 6 he posted in this thread. And I'm not saying you're wrong, I am just not finding the 60 in any of his posts.....

Originally posted by Elara
Ike, I still don't see where you're getting 60- I only see the 6 he posted in this thread. And I'm not saying you're wrong, I am just not finding the 60 in any of his posts.....

Ditto... not seein' the reference to 60...

Originally posted by IkeWRX
It was Canzoomers number so ask him :)

Come on, Ike, READ, don't just imagine the flame bait! I just quoted the only part of canzoomer's post to mention a number, and that number was 6. You can't just make up your own number (like 60), pretend it was canzoomers, and then continue to quote that number!

You're wrong, and we all know it - why don't you just admit it before you make yourself look even more foolish trying to defend it? ;)

Regards,
Gordon

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12559&perpage=15&pagenumber=3

Thanx, SC, for posting the reference that Ike should've originally pointed out when Gord asked him for a reference.

From CZ's post in THE OTHER THREAD, he's referring to 60 throughout North America, whereas in THIS thread he states 6 incidents in Canada

Jeesh, it's like a witchhunt around here, sorry for making you search Gord, and for going to diner when there was important info to be posted :p

Rabinabo, I agree it's very normal to have problems with a new model year car, but the engine thing is most troubling, hopefully they find the cause fast and get it fixed. If in fact there is a problem, maybe the 60 was a typo...

Originally posted by canzoomer
It seems this failure is caused by a fault in the oil injection system.
There are two injector per rotor.
Front injecto on front rotor fails to squirt, usually at highway use above 4,000 rpm over sustained time.

Front seals fail, seizes, ECU throws a check engine, andpower drops.

Will run on limp mode a few miles.

Re-starting is difficult, and if achieved will make a sound like a bad old clattering diesel.

About 60+ in N. America have done this so far.

How do I know?

Happened to me on Tuesday.
New engine is on it's way from Japan.
Apparently they have used up all the ones in stock over here.

In the meantime I will be driving a Camry from Enterprise at Mazda's expense.

sigh...

:o Sigh, don'cha just hate it when the trolls are right? ;) Apologies to you, Ike - I hadn't seen that other thread.

Regards,
Gordon

Thanks Ike- I just wasn't able to find it on my own. Didn't look hard enough.

Originally posted by IkeWRX
It was Canzoomers number so ask him :) I've heard the problems with the M3 but I'm not sure how common it is but never heard the S2K problems. Who knows, maybe it's more common than I realize on newly introduced engines. If Canzoomer is correct with the 60 that puts it at about 1 per 100 that have been sold thus far considering they are awaiting more from Japan (again according to Canzoomer). Not a huge number but we're talking cars that haven't even cracked 10k miles yet.

Peter, I wouldn't worry about it since it's not going to do any good, just enjoy the car.

Ike

OK, 60+ is partially by extrapolation.

Here is how I came up with that figure:

I spoke with people at Mazda in parts distribution and in dealer service and managed to eke out that around 66 extra engines have come in to North America so far.

All of these have gone out for dealer replacements, there are none left in stock in USA or Canada, and they are on back order status.

Of the engine failures I have found so far, where I was able to reach the owners ( 8 so far) all have been failures like mine.
Of 4 in Canada so far I have found, 3 were identical, and one was quite similar.
All 8 were in cars with VIN #'s below 3,000.
When I asked about my replacement engine they told me they are sending from Japan, and that they have been told that all the failed engines are now going back to Japan.

That is not so unusual, as they have no facility here for rebuilding.
By talking to dealers (including through a friend who is the head mechanic at one of them) we have pieced together that the failures seem to be related to the front oil injector, and failure of the front rotor front end side seals.

This is what I have gathered so far.

Regarding the 6 in Canada and 60+ in USA:
Mazda is bringing in/ has brought in 700 cars to Canada.
They have brought in 6 engines so far, and have used them up in replacements.

In the USA Mazda is bringing in/ has brought in around 3,500 cars this year. Apaprently 60 or so engines have come in to USA parts, and all are gone.

Every person I have been able to track down so far who got a replacement had a similar or identical failure.

8 out of 66+ is not absolutely definitive, but so far I have not found any other failure type in the 8 cases i have found.

Maybe I am drawing the wrong conclusions, but so far the evidence supports what I said.

What also puzzles me:

Many of us have seen the oil light problem, and quite a few people have had oilpans replaced by dealers when they contacted Mazda with a customer complaint.

Yet there is still no official Service Bulletin.

They have done a service bulletin on installing the front license plate, on where the hidden bolt is to allow the dealers to remove the centre front console, and one on the suspension of the optional add on shock sensor for the alarm system.

But nothing on the oil light/replacement oil pan.

When I contacted Mazda Canada in early September about this they thought I was making it up, and had not heard about it.
I suggested they lookup the replacement oil pan part #:
N3H8-10-4AXA.

They checked the Canada and USA parts systems and found it existed in the USA inventory. They checked and got back to me to say that they were working on a Canadian Service Bulletin, but it would take a while as they had to "translate it into French" and they "had to bring in the parts"

That was 6 weeks ago, and still no service bulletin in Canada or the USA.

Smells fishy to me.

Is it related to the engine failure?

I do not know.

It IS the oil system, they also replaced the dipsticks with one that shows the indexes higher as a port campaign.

That is 3 oil system related issues now, and still nothing being officially said.

I am suspicious.

OK so here's a stupid question - I've heard some folks talk about their vin numbers and such - are you referring to the last 4 digits of the vin # when you're talking about 'low' numbers?

eg: my VIN number ends wth 01959, so I presume that's a pretty low one?

I had the oil light issue and have had my oilpan replaced. No check engine lights to date, however.

Simon

Originally posted by sferrett
OK so here's a stupid question - I've heard some folks talk about their vin numbers and such - are you referring to the last 4 digits of the vin # when you're talking about 'low' numbers?

eg: my VIN number ends wth 01959, so I presume that's a pretty low one?

I had the oil light issue and have had my oilpan replaced. No check engine lights to date, however.

Simon
Exactly.
Mine is 01877

Originally posted by canzoomer
Exactly.
Mine is 01877

Carzoomer,
I too had the check oil light @ a steady 6000 RPM and had the dealer change my oilpan. Since the "modification" the only time I have seen the oil light come on is when the oil has been borderline, and the ambiant temperature has been near freezing. Currently I have onlt 3700 miles on my odometer, and this is mostly in town driving with 1 - 2 hours of highway time per week.
PS My VIN is REALLY low...0509

my engine, which was replaced, was on vin 101365, and I often had the oil light come on at long interstate speeds

does appear to be some sort of pattern

The only things that I have noticed about my engine, other than the corrected "oil warning light" is a gasoline smell at startup. The gasoline smell doesn't occur often, but maybe once a week...unfortunately I haven't noticed a pettern.
Is there anything else that I should keep an eye out for being that my VIN is the lowest that I have seen here yet?

Posted for Dad (Twin 8s!).... his account is still hosed.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
We have two RX-8s. Both are 6MT. My last five are 10172. My wife’s is 12527. Mine was purchased 09/09/03, my wife’s came in on 09/19/03. I had the oil light problem at 2450 miles and they replaced the pan and sensor. My wife has not seen the problem. I had a CEL come on, on the way to work at 45MPH. Got to work made an appointment to get checked, and that afternoon after messing with the gas cap, it did not come when I started the car. I have 3600 on mine now and my wife has 2200. I am getting about 22MPG and my wife is at 21MPG. Have been watching the entries regards oil related problems. Thank you for the data. I hope there is not at direct tie between the oil warning issue and engine failure… just do not want the hassle.

Will be standing by for data. This forum was the only way I knew to ask questions about the oil pan, thanks for the good information.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

I wanted to clarify my VIN...
100509...

My Vin is ...101212, and just got back Sunday with ~ 4500 rpm (80-85 mph) run for 4+ hours.

No issues with CEL or Oil lights then, or ever. Averaged 21 mpg.

Not to say that its not worrisome, but ...

The 2002 M3 model had the nice problem of blowing the engine randomly. The http://yoy.com/auto/m3_failure_index.html site has the info. Considering how many m3s are sold, this is a high number. Original WRX had tranny and clutch issues in its first year. The US didn't get that model, so we were lucky in sense. Engine problems suck, but in first years its almost inevitable.

The good news is Mazda seems to be replacing them without many questions (unlike the BMW m3 incidents... terrible in my opinion, BMW, shame on you).

my vin is 5469,my oil light came on a few times when car was new,under 2000 miles.i now have 7500 miles and have only seen the oil light twice in the last 5500 miles and i drive on the highway 5 days a week (80 miles rt) usually at avg 75 to 80 mph with sustained speeds.does this make sense to anyone,its almost like the problem has went away by its self.on another note my dealer keeps telling me that mazda has not released the oil pan yet but are aware of the problem.i just brought the car in 2 weeks ago and sat there while the called whomever at mazda with the response no eta yet on the pan,makes no sense?

What's this about an oil pan?

Anybody lower than 00716? (Either never seen the oil light or not very observant. Hope the former.)

Shebam,
I have a VIn of 000818 (I think I put something in the 500s in an earlier post, but I mistakenly cut and past my VIN from an email that Mazda prematurely sent). Anyway, I would get the intermitten oil light when cruising at highways speeds at a steady 4000 rpm. I could change gears, or just speed up/slow down, and the light would go right off. At first I thought that I needed to add oil, but that wasn't the case. I then read a post in this forum discussing the same issue. I went to my dealership in gaithersburg, MD, and they knew about the oil pan "issue". They ordered the new oil pan (The told me that Mazda had slightly modified the baffles) and when the part arrived (In two days), they replaced it. As it worked out, I got an early oil change out of the deal...not that it really mattered since they are free anyway! After the replacement, I have not seen the oil light come on again.

I am one of the people running on the replacement engine. It was replaced at 168 miles due to a 'rear' rotor fault. Before they diagnosed it as such, they tried the hotter plugs thinking that would solve it.

Here is the thread of my ordeal:

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11862&highlight=168+miles

Does it suck for a new car to have these issues? Sure, but that is the risk of being an early adopter.

More good and bad news.

My engine finally showed up at the dealers this week.
Took 3 weeks, as there were apparently some logistics issues.
Seems that either they misinformed me about when it was shipped, or they did not make very good arrangements for trucking and customs paperwork from the USA to here for the shipment.

Here is the letter I wrote today to the person I am dealing with at Mazda Canada public relations.
It details the experiences of this week. I have blanked the names to protect the innocent.

Hi XXXXX.
I tried calling you on Friday, but they tell me you were away on a seminar.

Some updates from my side.

The engine arrived at ZZZZZ Mazda at 5:15 p.m. on Wednesday the 12th.
They worked on it, exchanging the unit on Thursday, finishing up on Friday morning.
On Friday morning they called me and said it was installed, but they were having problems getting it to start.

After a few calls between the dealer and Mazda Canada people it was determined that they had to re-program the ECU, immobilizer, etc., so that it could be started.
The unit even came with a new ECU.

They tried to do this but ran into a big problem:
Apparently to program it they need a set of TWO ignition keys.
They had the one I left with them.
The other is in my desk drawer at my office.

As they called me on Friday afternoon to tell me this, and as they are about 165 kilometers south of me, it proved impossible to get the other key to them that day by closing time.

This necessitated my making some rather short notice travel arrangements to Phoenix.
I managed to secure a flight, and made arrangements for a rental while I am there.
On Thursday, when I was told the needed parts were there, ZZZZZ told me that he foresaw no problem in getting my car done by Saturday (today).

So, I did not make arrangements for a rental to allow me to travel to Arizona.
By the time we realised on Friday afternoon that this was not going to happen, and as I could not reach you, I did not have any options to make arrangements for a rental that I could use to make my trip.

I am leaving town on Monday morning by plane to Phoenix.
I asked the people at ZZZZZ Mazda to call Mazda Canada and ask them to Fedex a set of 2 keys to the dealer, so they can complete the work (hopefully).

Personally I find it a bit frustrating that they were sent a new engine, ECU and everything else, but nobody at Mazda Canada bothered to tell them they needed both keys, or did not provide a set of keys with the shipment. Mazda Canada had 3 weeks to do this, after all.

Immobilizer systems that use keys with a chip in them are not exactly a new technology.

That the procedure requires two keys is not something that I or the dealer would likely know in advance.

I return next Thursday night.

I spoke with ZZZZZ with the understanding that I would expect to be going to pick up my car next Friday, the 21st.

I will keep receipts for my travel expenses and forward copies of them to you after I return.

My next trip is to Utah around December 2nd.
I am hopeful that by then I might have a functioning car.

I am also hoping that the new engine is one that will not have the flaws in it that caused this failure.

I also pray that the change will result in a car that can get better gas mileage than I have seen to date.
If not I will have to buy a gas can to keep in the trunk, as my present highway range is around 300km to 350km to an empty tank, and I know of at least 4 stretches on my route that exceed that, with few or no locations where I can purchase gasoline.

I look forward to your reply, comments, and possible remedies to the issues I have brought forward.


I still want to keep my RX-8 (barely) but I am trusting that your firm can make me some decent offer to compensate me for my experiences to this point, and for the future.

If not, there would be little point in my making the trip to the dealership next Friday.

While I am away i will have access to email, so if you need to ask or tell me anything I will be able to correspond that way.

If it is urgent you could also call my cell phone.

Thanks for your assistance and perseverance in this episode, XXXXX.

please do let us know what they say!

CZ: good luck with all this drama...sounds EXTREMLY frustrating.

on a nother note -
my VIN is 100510 and i've had no issues yet...niether CEL (which i'm guessing means "check engine light") nor oil light. i've got ~6300 miles on the car now...80 hwy/20 city driving.
swoodka - are u sure your VIN is "000818" and not "100818?

My vin is 679 and I've had no problems whatsoever.. my car feels strong above 7000 as well.. seemed to have gained a little extra kick around 1600 - 1800 miles. No CEL light ever, no check oil light ever, no squeaks, no rattles, no hesitation, no slow starts on cold mornings, no flooding issues (even after 10 foot trips).

I need to dyno my car or take it to a strip because it feels very powerful. I've hit 90 mph in distances less than 1/4 mile... easily. I know.. not very scientific. In any case the engine seems to have come alive recently... was not this powerful 500 miles ago.

Oh yes.. my city mileage averages 17 - 18 and highway driving is 22 - 24.

Good luck to you canzoomer! Hope you get your car back soon.

Originally posted by ELX13
CZ: good luck with all this drama...sounds EXTREMLY frustrating.

on a nother note -
my VIN is 100510 and i've had no issues yet...niether CEL (which i'm guessing means "check engine light") nor oil light. i've got ~6300 miles on the car now...80 hwy/20 city driving.
swoodka - are u sure your VIN is "000818" and not "100818?

ELX13,
Sorry, you are correct. Mazda sent me several emails when my VIN was assigned...coreections, corrections...my mistake.
The production date was 20030527.
I do want to reiterate. After the oil pan replacement, I have not seen the low oil warning light, except when the oil is low! The car is running great, especially with the cooler temperatures. This engine really loves cool, dense air!

Geeze...

More on the saga.
Sticking with the Good News/Bad News theme, this is the tale of the last week.

Good News:
Finally the car is ready!
Got a call back from Mazda Canada, and the dealer.
I went to pick it up Saturday morning.
They tell me they had done extensive testing with the new engine over the past few days. Apparently so, my odometer was up 189km!
Drove it home (170km), and it runs really nicely, smooth.
Power seems as good or better than the original engine.
The oil pan was changed to the new kind. No more oil light! Yay!
No definitive test yet, but it seems to be getting better mileage.
I know pretty darned well what amount of fuel this 170km trip takes me, as i have done it about 30 times in the last couple of months. I got back using noticeably less fuel than before

Bad news:
While I was at the dealers picking up the car I tried to open the glove box. Will not open. Tried the key, but it was not locked.
Showed it to their mechanic, but as it was Saturday afternoon he seemed disinclined to fix it then.
I had to get home fairly quickly as I had other business on Saturday, so I left without this being fixed, as it would have necessitated leaving the car another couple of days over the weekend, and I figure I will either fix it myself, or have my local dealer look at it.

Got home, looked at the car more closely later on Saturday.
Big dent in the rear driver side door. Obvious ding from another car door.
Scratch on the front right fender.
Dent in the driver side door sill. Looks like a seatbelt buckle was there and door closed on it. Buckle is slightly bent.
Battery cover is held on with four plastic clips. One is broken off.

So, almost there. At least I have my car back and it seems to run OK.
A bit of work with Mazda to do yet.

Onwards and upwards.

On the bright side this is the first time I have had to drive my RX-8 in snow and ice. With the Nokians I put on for the winter, and the traction control system it is almost as good as driving a 4 wheel drive.
Sweet.

Checked my VIN and is 105001 and it has only 3400 kms on it but I really only drive it 16 kms a day. I did take it on a long drive to Kingston and back and the Oil Light came on. Took it to Mazda and they just topped my oil up even though it was still in the Mid-range level on the dipstick. When I went in to get my oil change at 3000 kms they told me about the oilpan problem and that if my oil light comes on again they may have to replace the pan. But I doubt they know what there talking about cause it took them 3 hours to change my oil......idiots didn't know how to do it firstly and then when they thought they were done they didn't know how to "re-energize" the oil pump or thats what they told me???


My baby is about to go away for the winter (if it ever comes- great Indian Summer were having up here)

Cheers
ALT

Shit I would be just a little pissed! On the positive side you got your car back.

My new RX-8 (#121,xxx) starts easier, idles much smoother, doesn't do the idle dance at first cold start, doesn't stink up the garage near as much and seems to be getting better mileage.
It also is much smoother under light load and low RPMs.

Good luck!

Vince

CZ you seem pretty cool about having 4 instances of damage to the vehicle! How does this s*** happen? I just get the image of the old Samonsite commercial - the one where the gorilla is slamming the suitcase around in his cage... :(

Great news on the engine so far, though! I guess that was enough to buoy your spirits! I am really hoping that getting a later production date will avoid at least some of the initial teething problems. I will be interested in your mileage on the new engine.

BTW - what kind of dog is that?

Originally posted by Nubo
CZ you seem pretty cool about having 4 instances of damage to the vehicle! How does this s*** happen? I just get the image of the old Samonsite commercial - the one where the gorilla is slamming the suitcase around in his cage... :(

Great news on the engine so far, though! I guess that was enough to buoy your spirits! I am really hoping that getting a later production date will avoid at least some of the initial teething problems. I will be interested in your mileage on the new engine.

BTW - what kind of dog is that?

Actually I am a fairly patient person.
Besides what choices do I have?

I decided to keep the car, and passed on the buyout.
I am heavily invested in RX-8 projects.

The pup is a long haired miniature Dachshund

When he grow up he will look like this:

http://pets.burnerkitty.com/3603

http://www.dogbiz.com/dogs-grp2/dachshund-lh/dachs-lh.htm

So the good news about this is that you can apparantly pull out CanZoomer's mod chip, and still get a new engine if it blows up.

However, you may have to pay for a tow, unless you can take it out on the side of the road before the tow truck gets there to take you to Mazda.

Sorry for opening up an old thread, I got to it from a search and didn't see the date.

Originally posted by jdwk
So the good news about this is that you can apparantly pull out CanZoomer's mod chip, and still get a new engine if it blows up.

However, you may have to pay for a tow, unless you can take it out on the side of the road before the tow truck gets there to take you to Mazda.

Sorry for opening up an old thread, I got to it from a search and didn't see the date.

With the way we have packaged the kit now it takes 5 minutes and a 10mm socket and ratchet to remove it.

I love this mod and have read (or at least skimmed) the many threads discussing it. If I might ask a few questions (the answers to which may already be buried somewhere but I can't find them):

(1) Does the OEM ECU have any way to know, or record, the presence of the module via a fault code? (I would hate for it to cause warranty problems.)

(2) Using good gas, like 91 octane, does the more aggressive fuel mixture increase at all the probability of detonation, thus jeopardizing the engine?

(3) If the answer to (2) is yes, does the engine's knock sensor help avert this danger?

Thanks!

And to add to Hard 8's questions:

4) How much will it cost for the set-up in the US?

5) How far away are you from Washington state?

6) Are there any tell tale signs that something has been hooked up to the ECU?

Hi All:

Just for clarity's sake, it's the last five digits of your VIN that indicates what number of the production run your car was in that model year. Thus, a VIN ending in 00585 wold mean it was the 585th RX8 built this year. Next year, they'll start over with numbers that end in 200001.

Highest VIN I've seen thus far is in the mid-28,000 range for cars that are on US soil.

As for the 60-engine figure, let's say that it's dead accurate. At presumably about 30,000 cars built so far, sixty problem motors equates to a measly two-tenths of one percent. Let's say that only half the cars are on the road. Still four-tenths of one percent. And if we say the sixty motors are Canada-only -- still an extremely low failure rate.

A modern automobile is an incredibly complex device. Try reading your shop manual cover-to-cover some time if you doubt it. And just about every car model ever produced has had its fair share of teething problems in the first year. My '86 RX7 was a first-year-of-production car and it's given me 215,000 miles without any major problems, and my '94 is at about 91,000 - same deal. So obviously I'm sold on Mazda Engineering and Quality Control.

My 93 MX-6 was a first prod year (and the first use of the KL). Only problem it had was the ignitor failing at 110k, and too small for SUVs to notice. It was still running perfectly when I was rear ended, ending it's life at 122k miles.

My ex-girlfriend's 03' Mazda 6s is a first year and one of the first off the lot. She has had absolutely no problems with it last time I talked to her (although the Duratec 3.0 is not really a new engine). She claimed there is a metallic rattle in the dash during certain types of music, but I could never hear it, and her sanity was questionable anyway.

As far as first year cars go, Mazda seems to have a pretty good track record. I would like to know the figures on other first year cars. 60 replaced engines sounds like a lot.

After seeing how the average 20 something sales guy has absolutely no regard for "break-in" period, my guess would be most of the failures were due to too much abuse too early in it's life.

Originally posted by Hard 8
I love this mod and have read (or at least skimmed) the many threads discussing it. If I might ask a few questions (the answers to which may already be buried somewhere but I can't find them):

(1) Does the OEM ECU have any way to know, or record, the presence of the module via a fault code? (I would hate for it to cause warranty problems.)

(2) Using good gas, like 91 octane, does the more aggressive fuel mixture increase at all the probability of detonation, thus jeopardizing the engine?

(3) If the answer to (2) is yes, does the engine's knock sensor help avert this danger?

Thanks!

1) ANY ECU fault event is supposed to be stored. Using the device will not cause additional faults.
Ironically there is a bug in the RX-8 ECU where it does not usually store ECU events if thebattery is disconnected.
2) The chance of detonation is increased with a leaner mixture.
AS we are mainly leaner at places where the tuning was originally extremely over-rich the chances of detonation are no greater than running at medium throttle on the highweay with stock tuning.
3) The knock sensor could respond to knock, restarding ignition. In practice it is not triggered as knock should not occur.

Hope this helps.

Very helpful; thanks!!

By the way, as for the battery disconnect issue, do you have any sense of whether the factory ECU learns your driving style, such that it's a bad (or good?) idea to clear its memory and start from scratch? I remember that Sport Compact Car tried that with a WRX and lost almost 40 horsepower with a battery disconnect (driving hard with good gas, they had taught the ECU to employ much more aggressive fuel and timing curves than the defaults--they lost all that when they cleared the ECU).

(Also, I wonder whether the factory defaults are evolving month by month, such that a reflash (assuming it's even available) would have any benefits? So far my reading of this forum seems to tell me the answer is no, but I still think it's possible.)

Thanks again!

Canzoomer can you answer questions 4, 5, and 6 from above. Thanks.

Originally posted by 93rdcurrent
And to add to Hard 8's questions:

4) How much will it cost for the set-up in the US?

5) How far away are you from Washington state?

6) Are there any tell tale signs that something has been hooked up to the ECU?

We are still selling this for $500 USD
Shipping by Fedex Ground, insured, is $25

After Jan. 1 the price is going up to $750
We are not making much on it, and we want dealers closer to you to be able to sell it.
They have to make a buck too, and between those two reasons we simply had to raise the price.
However I promised this to a lot of people at $500, so as long as ordered by Jan. 1, and paid for by Jan. 15th, we will still do the $500


We are in Alberta, due north of Montana.

If you remove it there is no sign.
One should pay attention to details like dirty fingerprints, etc.
In general one does not need to remove it, as the dealer has no normal reasons to open the ECU cover. AS it is about 10 minutes of work few will do it just for the hell of it.
All theor electronic tests are performed by hooking up to the OBD port inside the car, under the dash.

For normal service it is best to remove it"just in case", I think.
Personally, however, i will not even bother, as i know the dealer I go to will not give me grief.

Originally posted by 93rdcurrent
And to add to Hard 8's questions:

4) How much will it cost for the set-up in the US?

5) How far away are you from Washington state?

6) Are there any tell tale signs that something has been hooked up to the ECU?

We are still selling this for $500 USD
Shipping by Fedex Ground, insured, is $25

After Jan. 1 the price is going up to $750
We are not making much on it, and we want dealers closer to you to be able to sell it.
They have to make a buck too, and between those two reasons we simply had to raise the price.
However I promised this to a lot of people at $500, so as long as ordered by Jan. 1, and paid for by Jan. 15th, we will still do the $500


We are in Alberta, due north of Montana.

If you remove it there is no sign.
One should pay attention to details like dirty fingerprints, etc.
In general one does not need to remove it, as the dealer has no normal reasons to open the ECU cover. AS it is about 10 minutes of work few will do it just for the hell of it.
All theor electronic tests are performed by hooking up to the OBD port inside the car, under the dash.

For normal service it is best to remove it"just in case", I think.
Personally, however, i will not even bother, as i know the dealer I go to will not give me grief.

Canzoomer,

I am very interested and would be willing to pay the extra $250 if my dealer could order it and it would not void my warranty. Are you working with any dealers right now?

Yeah, that's one downside... dealers. We all see posts here about clueless dealers, and those that are just plain evil (sarcasm).

Maybe CZ has a good relationship with his and they'd do it, but if any Joe Schmo walks in off the street and requests it, I'm not sure all dealers would comply considering the type of mod it is.

There might be some serious backlash from them.

Any thoughts?

Yeah sell it to Mazdaspeed... I know that it has been hard work but if they were willing to compensate well?

Yes, of course, Mazda will buy it. Why would Mazda buy something they already have.

All this mod does is return the car back to pre-production state.

Mazda hosed the fuel maps to increase the life of the cats thanks to an insanely stupid US regulation requiring them to last 120k miles.

If Mazda was willing to destroy their pride and joy to meet this regulation, they certainly aren't going to sell the mod themselves.

However, I can see Mazda supporting Canzoomer et al under wraps. I am sure they want the true 247hp, 18/24 mpg RX-8 on the road more than anyone.

JDWK,
Because as we all know Mazda will not admit first hand what they have done. However they may be willing to offer an aftermarket ECU upgrade through Mazdaspeed. Especially if on the '05's or '06's they find another way of dealing with the problem like high temp cats. for those of us with '04's Mazda might want to make us happy and offer more hp. Also I don't think that CZ's upgrade is strictly taking the ECU map back to the original configuration since the hp rating was 247hp at the crank and not the wheel where we are hearing from CZ that his will make 250hp at the wheel. And he hasn't stated that his chip will bring the cars to posted EPA mpg. Has Mazda been working on ECU upgrades? If they haven't and they don't want to throw all the time and money into R&D then they might be willing to pay a third party for their hard work. Did Acura do all of their own R&D on upgrades they offered for the NSX or did they higher a race driver with a good reputation blowing up Civics and CRXs? hmmm.... I wander?