Yesterday I found that I could not get my car in reverse while it was sitting in my driveway. Bummer! While I was sitting there I noticed that the other gears were also difficult to engage. Now this is going to sound bizarre but after some experimentation I found that the car shifts fine if it is rolling. :confused:

IMO it feels like the clutch is not fully disengaging. I've looked at the obvious things like: checking the hydraulic fluid reservoir, looking for leaks, and making sure nothing is wedged under the clutch pedal (i.e. floor mat) but everything seems OK. I thought about bleeding the clutch but I don't want the dealership accusing me of screwing it up. So it is going into the shop tomorrow morning.

Has anyone else seen this problem?

I think two other people have posted a similar problem, a few weeks back. Search around a bit and you should be able to find it. I don't recall how their problem was resolved.

Originally posted by 8_wannabe
I think two other people have posted a similar problem, a few weeks back. Search around a bit and you should be able to find it. I don't recall how their problem was resolved.

I found some similar threads (http://www.rx8forum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11693&highlight=shift) but it is really not the same thing. They can at least get their cars in gear and rolling under its own power. Where as I have to get out and push the car so that I can get it to slip into gear. Anyways, I hope that the dealership will be able to fix it tomorrow and I can get back to enjoying my 8. :)

try this.. put a little pressure on the shift lever and then slowly release the clutch so that it just slips a TINY bit. This will cause the gears inside the tranny so start moving to the shift dogs and match up with the output gears. Most manual transmissions will occasionally do this when sitting at a stop. Nothing is moving and the pegs aren't line up with the holes, so nothing happens! Just slips that clutch a little and it should slide right into place.

Originally posted by Tresch
try this.. put a little pressure on the shift lever and then slowly release the clutch so that it just slips a TINY bit. This will cause the gears inside the tranny so start moving to the shift dogs and match up with the output gears. Most manual transmissions will occasionally do this when sitting at a stop. Nothing is moving and the pegs aren't line up with the holes, so nothing happens! Just slips that clutch a little and it should slide right into place.

Thanks for the suggestion but I've already tried that and it just causes the gears to grind. :(

Take it to the shop. It's not right.

Sounds like the clutch is misadjusted to me, which means that you've got a problem because this is a self adjusting clutch.

In My opinion, the slave or master cylinder on the clutch is bad. It's a common enough problem on Japanese hydraulic clutches. Take it to the dealer. They should be able to replace it easily. All the best.

Try shifting the lever into first before attempting reverse.
If you're having problems shifting into first, try 2nd first.

I've had similiar problems w/ my Integra, dont recall why it was so but it appeared to pretty common.

The dealership looked at my car and diagnosed the problem as a clutch failure and have placed the parts on order. In the mean time they want me to drive the car until the parts come in. I find that kind of odd, you would think, if the clutch is dead, that they would want to keep the car parked until it could be fixed to prevent any more damage.

After the work is done I want to see the damaged parts so I at least know what really happened to the car. The only thing that I can think of, that is clutch related, that would cause this problem would be a bent throw out arm. :confused:

As I know more I'll keep you posted.

Did they say if it was the pressure plate bolts? At least two people with similar symptoms had loose pressure plate bolts as reported in the tech garage.

Originally posted by blizz81
Did they say if it was the pressure plate bolts? At least two people with similar symptoms had loose pressure plate bolts as reported in the tech garage.

No, they wouldn't tell me anything more than it was a "clutch failure". I plan on asking for the old parts when the work is done just so that I can see what really went wrong.

Off to the dealer for you....

I got my car back from the dealer today and was a little surprised by what they showed me. Before you ask, let me say that the bolts on the pressure plate had not backed out. Instead the clutch had over heated and completely cooked the springs to the point that they were just rattling around. Also the metal had turned a purplish blue color.

They did replace the clutch under warranty and it is also worth noting that the rattle that I had around 5k RPMs is now gone. I hate saying this but I think that a bunch of people are going to see premature clutch failures. The reason that I say this, is because there are already several threads that are discussing similar problems (i.e. metalic rattle and difficult shifting) to what I had right before the clutch failed. :(

I now have 7,500 miles on my car and hopefully the new clutch will last considerably longer.

woah, what could have caused that to happen?
________
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Originally posted by P00Man
woah, what could have caused that to happen?

I'm a little perplexed myself because I have normally gotten 60,000+ miles out of a clutch in my previous cars and my driving/shifting habits have been the same with my RX-8. So what's up with that? :confused:

Update:
The new clutch just doesn't feel right at the pedal. When I'm easing the clutch out, the first half of its travel is dead. The clutch doesn't do anything until it is past the halfway point, the friction point is 2/3 of the way through its travel and it is not fully engaged until the pedal is completely released. It feels like the clutch is not adjusted properly but the dealer claims that there is no way to adjust it because it is hydraulic.

Can anyone shed some light on this for me? Is there an easy way to adjust the friction point or do I need to harass the dealer and get them to look at it again?

A couple of things.

My clutch does nothing until the pedal has travelled to about half the travel up the throw. This I believe is the correct point to engage the clutch plate so it could be that you learnt your clutch wrong because it was never right, and it is now working correctly which is freaking you out.

Second, a hydraulic clutch may be self-adjusting, but it is adjustable. I do not have a manual for this car yet so I cannot tell you how to adjust it, but on other hydraulic clutches that I have owned adjustment could be forced by pumping the pedal about a fifty times with the engine off.

Last, if you don't feel the clutch slipping, I would guess that it is fully engaged fully released and that all is working well. Let's hope that you are just being sensitive because it has shown itself to be weak, and all will be smooth sailing from here out.

All the best -

H

Well, if that's right, then mine is broken too, and so was the only other Mazda I've driven (my neighbour's MX-6). It has a light action, and the friction point is close to the floor.

My old Prelude was the opposite - took more effort to press, and did nothing until I let it up at least halfway.

If the clutch doesn't feel right, I would keep after the dealer on it.

I know it's not an RX-8, but one time I had the clutch replaced in my Integra, and the new clutch felt weird just like yours does. I took it back to the shop, and they told me that there was no adjustment because it was a hydraulic clutch, and that it just "is how it is".

But it kept bothering me, and finally I took it back again. This time, when I picked up the car, the clutch was magically "fixed" and behaved totally normal again. The guy at the shop wouldn't say what was wrong and how he fixed it, but I got the impression that it was some sort of little "dumbass" thing he didn't do right when he installed the clutch.

So if it doesn't feel right, it probably isn't. Keep after them. Good luck!

The engagement point on mine is close to the floor - well before half-travel.

I think they didn't adjust something right when they installed it... Keep climbing your way up through the service managers until you get someone who is willing to diagnose it without just waving it off.

Simon.

The only thing that I can think of that is adjustable is the linkage between the pedal and the master cylinder. I'll take a peek at it tomorrow and make sure that there is a small amount of play between the pedal and linkage when the pedal is up just to make sure that the clutch is fully engaged. If that doesn't help I'll give the dealer another call.

earlier I also posted a problem shifting.. but it hasn't happened since.

first somebody said that the bolt backed out on their pressure plate or something like that..

now you show that yours was because something happened that overcooked the clutch causing the metal to turn purple (yikes! that looked pretty wild).

I'm wondering how many other owners are having clutch/shifting problems?

I think I'll post a poll on it...

My 626 has 135,000 miles and it's still on the original clutch. It needs a new one though, inconsistent engagement. That or just an adjustment.

Originally posted by Zio
My 626 has 135,000 miles and it's still on the original clutch. It needs a new one though, inconsistent engagement. That or just an adjustment.

let me rephrase myself...

"I'm wondering how many other RX-8 owners are having clutch/shifting problems?

I hate saying this but I think that a bunch of people are going to see premature clutch failures.

does this quote freak anyone else out?

I have 250 miles on my 8 now and the clutch has always been very strange to me. Like speedracer said, the first half of the travel is completely dead. It's like there's nothing there. I'd honestly like it if there weren't so much extra travel there. It seems kind of unnecessary to me.

Speed, did they adjust your clutch and say if anything was wrong with it or did they say that this was the proper position? I've got to take my car in to get the L flash done (I was surprised they didn't do it before I picked it up) so I figure I'll have them look at the clutch too.

I don't really have any problems shifting, I just don't really like the extra travel I've got in my clutch. It's nothing like any of the other manuals I've driven (350Z, Trans Am, Mini) and I find that odd.

Originally posted by Ajax
I have 250 miles on my 8 now and the clutch has always been very strange to me. Like speedracer said, the first half of the travel is completely dead. It's like there's nothing there. I'd honestly like it if there weren't so much extra travel there. It seems kind of unnecessary to me.

Speed, did they adjust your clutch and say if anything was wrong with it or did they say that this was the proper position? I've got to take my car in to get the L flash done (I was surprised they didn't do it before I picked it up) so I figure I'll have them look at the clutch too.

I don't really have any problems shifting, I just don't really like the extra travel I've got in my clutch. It's nothing like any of the other manuals I've driven (350Z, Trans Am, Mini) and I find that odd.

At least on the hydraulic clutch in my maxima, you can adjust the amount of pedal freeplay. I assume this is fairly common across the board for hydraulic clutches. If you can, finding out how would be another question, but I just wanted to throw that out there.

The dealer said that there were "NO" adjustments on the clutch and I'd have to live with it.

One afternoon, I was telling one of my friends about the dealer's comments and he said that they were full of it and he was right. He found that the linkage on the clutch pedal is adjustable and it only took a couple of turns before the clutch felt right. So the problem has been fixed. :D

Is there any reason you'd want the clutch to be as long as it is now?

I cant think of any, in fact, I think it's kinda dangerous.

There are a couple of reasons to have a longer travel. It gives you more leverage against the clutch and it makes the pedal feel lighter. The extra travel also gives you more control over when the clutch engages.

Personally I would rather see a shorter travel and have a faster engaging clutch.

so how did you pal adjust the clutch Speed Racer????

Jeff

If you look at the very top of the clutch pedal assembly you will see the linkage which goes through the firewall. If I remember correctly it is a threaded rod with a couple of nuts. The first nut (closer to driver) acts as a lock nut and needs to be loosened before you can make any adjustments. The second nut (closer to firewall) adjusts the amount of slack/freeplay in the linkage. Turning it clockwise should give you more slack. When you find a position that feels right tighten the lock nut. :D

Originally posted by Speed Racer
I'm a little perplexed myself because I have normally gotten 60,000+ miles out of a clutch in my previous cars and my driving/shifting habits have been the same with my RX-8. So what's up with that? :confused:


I am glad I read this thread. Just recently I have been haveing a hard time getting into reverse. All the other gears are fine. But, I am going to make a appointment for my 8 for next week now.

I see another substandard Mazda rental car in my future..

Originally posted by Speed Racer
If you look at the very top of the clutch pedal assembly you will see the linkage which goes through the firewall. If I remember correctly it is a threaded rod with a couple of nuts. The first nut (closer to driver) acts as a lock nut and needs to be loosened before you can make any adjustments. The second nut (closer to firewall) adjusts the amount of slack/freeplay in the linkage. Turning it clockwise should give you more slack. When you find a position that feels right tighten the lock nut. :D


Okay guys..I need to vent! I Just got of the phone with Cap Maz..and my normal rep who I have been working with is on vacation... I told them I would like to bring my car in to get the reverse checked out. He was like well..u have to double clutch it to make it go into reverse..its a close ratio six speed transmision and reverse takes a little bit more to get into. I was like...man, I dont' have to double clutch my car..THATS WHAT SYNCROS ARE FOR...two I had my car since AUGUST and I have never had this problem. Make my apointment check out my car AND DON'T TREAT ME LIKE AN IDIOT!! Argghhh.... man, I knew I was in for some bull when he told me my rep was on vacation.

I wish they wouldn't give us the run around when something is obviously wrong with the car.

Keep us posted about your appointment and it outcome.

Originally posted by Speed Racer
I wish they wouldn't give us the run around when something is obviously wrong with the car.

Keep us posted about your appointment and it outcome.

No doubt..

Okay guys..I need to vent! I Just got of the phone with Cap Maz..and my normal rep who I have been working with is on vacation... I told them I would like to bring my car in to get the reverse checked out. He was like well..u have to double clutch it to make it go into reverse..its a close ratio six speed transmision and reverse takes a little bit more to get into. I was like...man, I dont' have to double clutch my car..THATS WHAT SYNCROS ARE FOR...two I had my car since AUGUST and I have never had this problem. Make my apointment check out my car AND DON'T TREAT ME LIKE AN IDIOT!! Argghhh.... man, I knew I was in for some bull when he told me my rep was on vacation.


Not saying you shouldn't keep pursuing action since the symptom has shown up over time, but his ranting and raving about synchros & reverse aren't entirely false. It is not uncommon in a car for reverse to have a very basic synchromesh in comparison to the other gears. Think about the engine speed when you're typically engaging reverse.

This is why a lot of manual transmission cars grind a bit going into reverse even when the car is just moving back slightly compared to at a full stop, and also why sometimes you have to try engaging the clutch again (not necessarily 'double clutching', but...you get my drift).


Speed Racer - procedure sounds good to me! Guys doing this, just make sure that you don't do what I did last time and screw the rod right out. It was a little bit of a pain to get it threaded back in and the linkage put back together, etc. :)

This morning the same thing happend. Clutch in, push down on the stick, over to the right..ease of gas..MISS.

I had to grab the stick with two hands to get it into reverse this morning.

I am convinced now that something is wrong. I have 11k on my 8 and this is my first REAL problem.

how much of a slope were you on?

Originally posted by Formula 420
how much of a slope were you on?

None. I parked in a level garrage.

I went to lunch with a co-worker and the same thing happend.

So, when we got back I rushed the car to the dealer... and of course I couldn't re-create the problem. So I am not one to cry wolf..period. But, the agents from Ford who were covering for the Mazda people thought I didn't know what I was talking about.

Why must Mazda be in bed with Ford????

Anyway..I wanted them to give me a rental for the weekend so they can work out this issue with my 8 and they were like no..you have to bring it back in Monday..

Very frustrateing.

9-K Rever

Glad I seen this thread too, I'm having the same problem with reverse. On the phone now with Mazda!

Originally posted by silver1_rx8
Glad I seen this thread too, I'm having the same problem with reverse. On the phone now with Mazda!


Let us know what they say!

Just got off with the Service department at Mazda, they know me well now with the recalls and flooding. They said that I can bring it monday to have it checked out and their manager complained about the same problem with his 8.

Enterprise rental here I come...

Originally posted by silver1_rx8
Just got off with the Service department at Mazda, they know me well now with the recalls and flooding. They said that I can bring it monday to have it checked out and their manager complained about the same problem with his 8.

Enterprise rental here I come...

Riddiculas..the stupid Ford people were trying to talk to me like I was an idiot.

The Mazda people know me..and they know I hate bringing my car in there cuz it means I have to seperate from it. The also know I know my car, and I only come in for basic maintance.

So hopfuly I will have a better experience on Monday.

Once again..very frustrateing.

Okay, I get my care back from the shop and they say there is nothing wrong with my tranny or clutch. They didn't even take it out to see if there could be an issue. They just shifted it a couple of times and since it didn't act up on them, they figured it was fine.

I am kinda pissed about it. But, hey, all I know is Mazda will be eating a warrenty claim if something seriously f-ed up happens to my tranny due to their neglegence.

9-K Rever

When you are having trouble getting into reverse, have you tried going into a couple other gears first before trying to put it in reverse?

I've had to work a number of MT cars into reverse that I owned or backed out for whatever reason. Generally I shift into the gears around reverse and then into reverse. If it's still not going in smoothly, I lift off the clutch and re-engage, then do it all over again.

Why must Mazda be in bed with Ford????

Probably because Ford owns 33% of Mazda?

Found in Chicago Tribune article:
Ford and Mazda have done little to take advantage of each other's automotive expertise.

Ford bought an equity interest in the Japanese automaker in 1979 and a controlling interest in 1996. But other than exchanging greeting cards, the two have been distant.

When we recently asked president Nick Scheele why Ford waited so long to take advantage of Mazda and derive a product, he replied, "We haven't utilized the strengths of Mazda for years." Scheele could have said: "There wasn't any Mazda strength to utilize for years." Until the Mazda6.

Originally posted by blizz81
When you are having trouble getting into reverse, have you tried going into a couple other gears first before trying to put it in reverse?

I've had to work a number of MT cars into reverse that I owned or backed out for whatever reason. Generally I shift into the gears around reverse and then into reverse. If it's still not going in smoothly, I lift off the clutch and re-engage, then do it all over again.


I never had to do this before with the 8. So, I mean..what Speed Racer is saying about unusual cltuch wear may be the key..

Okay guys and gal (Elara) check this out. My chick and I go up to CAPITOL MAZDA this morning to drop off my car. First thing I see is my favorite Mazda team there and ready. No need to talk to the Ford people... Pull up, they greet me with my name and I tell them the issue. I give them the keys, and the Mazda mechanic was there, and he was like let me take a peek at it. Got in my car...ran through the gears..and walla....NASTY GRINDING NOISE IN REVERSE comes up. He was like...ahh...now thats a issue. They couldn't give me a ETA because they said they had to call Mazda to see what the issue may be. So, I could be w/o my 8 for a minute. The Ford side of the shop..didn't even do that much. So, hopefully I will hear something by the end of the day.