I hope this comes off the right way, but here goes...

One of the interesting things about this board is the number of people who hang around here who:
a) don't have an RX-8 or an RX-7
b) have no intention of purchasing one

If these people simply had an interest in the car, or an admiration for the engineering behind it, then I imagine things would run a lot more smoothly around here. However that obviously is not the case.

There are SOME people who fit the above description, who roam from thread to thread, posting negative things about the RX-8 at every available opportunity. They will hi-jack threads about completely unrelated topics to voice their complaints/criticism.

This message is for those people.

The RX-8 is a first year model. As such, it is never going to be *perfect*. However, it has been reviewed reasonably extensively by the major car magazines, websites etc etc. Car and driver, for example. The people who review for these places do it for a living. They could even be called experts! They get to drive more different types of cars in a year than most of us will drive in our lifetimes. They hence experience the absolute latest in technology, the BEST in modern automobiles, and also the worst.

These experts have consistently applauded the RX-8 as a marvellous piece of engineering. In comparison tests they have compared it favorably to most if not all of the 'competing' models in the same price and performance-range. Truth be told, I have yet to read a single negative review from a professional reviewer about this car.

In addition, most of the owners of this car love it dearly. Some are over-zealous in their defence of the vehicle, but they are so because they care strongly for their RX-8. There are a few people who have problems with the car, and some who seem to downright hate it for not being what they thought it was. By and large though, the response from owners, reviewers and random people who see it in the street without a hidden agenda has been overwhelmingly positive.

So the question stands: Why are some of you so obsessed with criticising this vehicle?

Don't crap on about how you find it interesting, and you really like the car but want to make sure we as owners aren't blind to its faults. We drive the bloody car every day. We LIVE with those faults on a daily basis and understand them in *perspective* better than you ever will.

Basically you own another vehicle. You don't have an RX-8, and will never buy an RX-8. If you plan on being a presence on these boards, then try being a constructive one. Nobody is blind enough to call the RX-8 a perfect car. It has its faults, and those faults are discussed. If you were to find an illuminating article on the car about said faults, or had first scoop on some news that helped us to understand/fix said faults, then sharing such information is constructive. Roaming the boards posting the same bullshit criticisms over and over and over again in seemingly random threads is not. Even when you try to pretend you 'like' the car.

If you have no intention of being constructive, then that makes you one thing:

a) A person who is so insecure about themselves, their vehicle and their place in the world that they get sheer pleasure from criticising the car of a complete stranger

b) Some idiot/asshole who is starting arguments and fights with a complete stranger for your own enjoyment

Now I'll probably get flamed for posting this, maybe get a warning from a mod, maybe have this thread deleted, or perhaps all of the above. But this is NOT a trolling post. It is a badly worded plea from a genuine owner of the car who wants to learn more about his own vehicle and enhance his enjoyment of it. The constant, repetitive trolling from some people on these forums is preventing that from happening, for all of us. So please either start being a constructive member of the forum, or shut the hell up :)

Oh, and have a nice day.

aussie77, you're my favorite person today. Thanks for the great post. Maybe I should start deleting posts by thread hijackers if they have nothing to do with the original. Might make things a lot happier around here.

May I also add, to delete threads that are asking for a very subjective matters.
1 Help me to choose colour
2 What interior colour should I go with
3 Which car should I get
4 What car should I get etc...
These are subjects that are so subjective, it only end up no where. I would dare say, one would normally still end up having no idea what he's gonna get after all the replies.

I completely agree with you aussie. It seems like there are more trolls then owners lately. It is getting very frustrating reading threads with so much of the same trolling over and over.

Thank god I am not the only one losing it over tolls here!

My next child will be named "aussie77" insuring he will grow up tough

I agree with the mindset of the post.

But I think the only thing threads like this will accomplish is riling up the other side, so to say, in a rally..."Yeah! Screw those trolls! Like this guy, _____!"

And then the guy gets mad and there's more overall trollage and flamage.

It's great that people don't like trolls. But threads like this aren't going to make anybody convert or leave peacefully.

(BTW, I drive a maxima, but yes...I am interested in the 8 :) )

Aussie, maybe you should try to IGNORE someone when they post something you don't like. Actually, if some people would learn just to IGNORE the trolls, the trolls would probably move on to other forums. Trolls are simply trying to cause controversy and arguments. They also love it when irate members post rambilng threads whining about their existence. Just let it go, man

Ah I'm generally learning to ignore them. I just figured that there is a chance some of these trolls do it out of ignorance, or without really considering the repercussions of their words/actions. Hence that post. An appeal to the mature adult lurking out there in almost everyone.

I mean the thing is, it isn't like as owners we aren't going to have questions or gripes about our own cars. Goodness knows if it weren't for these boards I would have had half the info about the hp issue. I also wouldn't have the benefit of hearing about issues/changes to the car past break-in. I wouldn't know of possible problems like the oil light.

So it isn't negative comments that ruin these boards. It is negative comments repeated over and over again in multiple threads by the same people, many of whom do not even own the car! They have zero hope of changing my mind about my purchase as it is by far the most enjoyable driving experience of my life - and I get that every day. So really all they are doing is interfering with the useful exchange of information... kind of like static on a phone line. So basically, these people are nothing more than static. Lucky them.

Some of them I *know* are intelligent enough because they compose intricate arguments, and some do a decent job of hiding their pattern of criticism. Those are the people I am appealing to. There is no way a post like this will change the mind of some moronic ricer-boy who cannot even use basic punctuation and feels the right to free speech gives him the right to run around bad-mouthing other people and their possessions all behind the anonymity of the internet. The happy thing is people of such low mental capacity generally manage to get themselves banned in short order :)

I personally am happy to hear the insights of someone who owns another vehicle. But let's have insights. Let's have intelligent comments/comparisons/ideas. This constant, repetitive criticism is a waste of everyone's time.

*clambers of his soap box and hugs it to his chest, curling into the fetal position*

I dont quite understand the mentality as well. I dont know why some non-owners feel the need to bash the car, and of all places, on a RX-8 forum!

I dont own an RX-8, I will have a 350Z, but I can appreciate the RX-8's virtues and I love the styling. If a person has nothing good to say about a vehicle, then why dont they just post on a general forum somewhere else. I think the only purpose that they come over here is to cause trouble. Its the "My car is better than your car, na na na na na na" mentality. That kind of thinking should have been left behind when kids grew up to be adults. Apparently, some of us did not make the transition. :D

In defense of rotary fanatics who are "over-zealous in their defence of the vehicle."

The fact of the matter is, by sheer numbers there aren't as many of us, as there are of them. Everytime I get in a conversation about cars and I bring up rotarys it is a throw of the dice. The majority of the responses I get from other car fanatics are usually of displeasure and contempt. Not all the time, but the majority of the time it is hard to find appreciation for the engines, and even less so for Mazda. This is not always the case, but it certainly happens a lot.

I always compare it to the Mustang/Camaro "Pony Wars", one side will never give in to the other. I think it's the same with pistons and rotors.

Funny thing I always find, is that most all engineers and competent mechanics love rotarys.

Not all of them are trolls, not all of them are here to trash threads. Some of them, I found, have very particular views; which are no more valid than mine.

I own an 8, I hate bashing, I like debate and conversation...and to have a good laugh from time to time.

I had bad first impressions on some members (from both groups, trust me!); some of them proved themselves after paying close attention to their posts and replies. Some of them still haven't -and possible never will.

Trust me on this one, I wouldn't stick around here if the only threads were were like: "My car is so perfect! Im not concerned about a thing!" - for the sole fact that it doesn't help me at all. I DO appreciate comments from owners of different makes and models, as much as I do appreciate help from people that own(ed) rotaries. Its the beauty/ugliness of the internet: There are TONS of information, you just have to KNOW how to get to it.

I agree, it might be easier to find something if that 'info' was not buried within CR..P (very conspicuous..)

I would seriously make this thing obligatory reading for all of us and new members: http://www.albion.com/netiquette/book

great post--I'm on your side
why do people waste their time on this forum if they have nothing to give thats benefical

Originally posted by Elara
aussie77, you're may favorite person today. thanks for the great post. Maybe I should start deleting posts by thread hijackers if they have nothing to do with the original. Might make things a lot happier around here.

Damn I am so glad someone else said what I have been thinking and saying. Going ahead of the class aussie77. For awhile I thought it was only me thinking that. What a relief.
:eek:

I too am over defensive of my RX-8, because I do not recognize any of the problems that have been experienced by a very low numbers of owners. If it wasn't for the trolls repeating these problems as if they were their own, we owners would understand the true and very small magnitude of these problems. The trolls make it twice as hard for the average reader to recognize a random failure from a wide spread problem. I feel that most of the problems we have seen presented on this board are random infant mortality failures that are expected up to a certain percentage and completely covered by warranty. Except for the HP, none are being experience fleet wide, and if we could weed through all the troll crap it would be very evident. Some of the problems that have been blown out of proportion this way are:

1. The very few who are experiencing 6 to 10 miles to the gallon are either having too much fun, can't calculate MPG properly, or truly have a warranty problem that needs fixed.

2. A/C not working. Mine works great in a very high temp/high humidity area. I have to turn mine down it gets so cold, so its not a design thing, its a broken A/C thing.

3. Rattles. Something is loose in your car, find it, tighten it, or take it to the dealer for them to do it.

4. Burns oil. A couple of people are burning way too much oil. Go to the dealer and get it fixed. 99% are reporting oil usage better than any other rotary ever made.

My car is working wonderfully, and I will continue to report it as so, until it is no longer true. I had high expectations, performed many other vehicle test drives, and made a decision that appears in my mind to be a great one. It makes me sick to think that some of this troll trashing of the RX-8 might have chased off a potential owner from what IMHO would have been the greatest driving experience of their lives. It has been mine.

I blame the Moderators.

With truckloads of RX-8s hitting the streets and related cover stories arriving in newsstands, it's inevitable that the trolls and haters started coming in droves. It's pretty obvious by the time a person has had even 5 posts if they have no legitimate interest in the 8 and nothing worthwhile to offer the community. These people need to get banned immeadiately. If not, the current negativity will just continue to get worse.

I believe it is from jealousy they have. Well, they want it badly, but they can't have it for some reason, so try to bash it. I believe that if they feel that whatever they have is superior to RX8, then they would not have to say anything. Those who do not have confidnece in what they have would have to bash what others have to make themselves feel better. Extremely childsh acts.

I also agree, many of the problems people a basing and keep on going on with are minor.

I have not had my oil light come on, not have I had a problem with the heat issue.

I still feel that if you are this unhappy, return the car. I just want to drive up to another RX8 onwer (if I ever see one) and know he or she is happy with their car. Not bash the car to everyone they know.

Maybe Mazda should interview prospective owners?

Originally posted by m477
I blame the Moderators.

With truckloads of RX-8s hitting the streets and related cover stories arriving in newsstands, it's inevitable that the trolls and haters started coming in droves. It's pretty obvious by the time a person has had even 5 posts if they have no legitimate interest in the 8 and nothing worthwhile to offer the community. These people need to get banned immeadiately. If not, the current negativity will just continue to get worse.


And if we started banning people using this as a rationalization, the cries of "unfair" would increase 10-fold. We don't ban people unless they have truly done something wrong, not just because we don't like their viewpoints.


I, too, anm having no problems with my car- gas mileage is better than the estimated, when my oil light came on, it was because I was down a quart and it wanted more. So my only issue was my own dumb fault.

Who would cry "unfair" Elara? Why must we allow people to post in the forum who obviously don't like the car? When it becomes obvious, give 'em the boot. They can still read the forum, just won't be able to write in it.

Freedom of speech? Doesn't apply in a forum. Let them write a letter to an editor or something. Why would anybody want to hear the ranting of someone who hates the car or Mazda? I certainly don't and why should I?

If a person posts nothing but negative things, bump after it is obvious. And don't wait until it is painfully obvious. Sure, a gripe or two from a legit member with a beef must be tolerated. I have one with the car. OK, two. Do you see me ranting all over the place? No, cuz, overall, the car is outstanding. If I hated it, had Mazda buy it back, came here & pissed all over everybody and anybody that shared the thread that I chose to piss in, & I got the boot, I would understand & proceed with the rest of my life.

Since I was accepted and allowed to join, have a right to remain a member of this forum. Not.

ps. Just saw my first Nordic Green & Winning Blue today. Both are very nice colors. The blue just got off the truck & needs cleaning badly. Still looks good even with all the dirt & the paper stuff still on it. Gotta go back soon to see it cleaned up. The green took center stage in the showroom. Very nice!

All the sales people know me at least by sight now. The one guy said they oughtta put me on payroll. I probably sold a few without knowinng, talking to some of the people who I find standing around, gawking ignorantly at an 8. :cool:

Originally posted by Racer X-8
Who would cry "unfair" Elara? Why must we allow people to post in the forum who obviously don't like the car? When it becomes obvious, give 'em the boot. They can still read the forum, just won't be able to write in it.

Freedom of speech? Doesn't apply in a forum. Let them write a letter to an editor or something. Why would anybody want to hear the ranting of someone who hates the car or Mazda? I certainly don't and why should I?

If a person posts nothing but negative things, bump after it is obvious. And don't wait until it is painfully obvious. Sure, a gripe or two from a legit member with a beef must be tolerated. I have one with the car. OK, two. Do you see me ranting all over the place? No, cuz, overall, the car is outstanding. If I hated it, had Mazda buy it back, came here & pissed all over everybody and anybody that shared the thread that I chose to piss in, & I got the boot, I would understand & proceed with the rest of my life.

Since I was accepted and allowed to join, have a right to remain a member of this forum. Not.

ps. Just saw my first Nordic Green & Winning Blue today. Both are very nice colors. The blue just got off the truck & needs cleaning badly. Still looks good even with all the dirt & the paper stuff still on it. Gotta go back soon to see it cleaned up. The green took center stage in the showroom. Very nice!

All the sales people know me at least by sight now. The one guy said they oughtta put me on payroll. I probably sold a few without knowinng, talking to some of the people who I find standing around, gawking ignorantly at an 8. :cool:

And how will we determine who's a legitimate poster? Should we ban someone who's had serious problems with the car and their first post is negative? Or, if we just don't like the way they say something about the car, how about then?

And we DO ban people who are obviously just here to troll. But sometimes it's a very fine line between people who are genuinely just stating their opinion and don't know how to be polite and the trolls. You don't just up and ban people because you feel like it.

And just because YOU wouldn't cry unfair doesn't mean other people won't. Just look at the thread about the moderators- as soon as it was posted, quite a few people jumped in saying yeah you're right, the moderators are too uptight and strict, what's up their asses. If we started banning people just because we didn't like then instead, can you imagine the trolling that would start up just like that? Ugh. No thanks.

I think they are ways to verifying each posting with validated VIN numbers, but in the end I don't think is a great idea to limit expression.

Much to my regret I do acknowledge that, it's the damn trolls that make us realize how great and special this car really is. Once you have to defend something you truly enjoy then one's passion and logic become infused and the result is a compelling argument.

You know the speech ......without evil there is no good. Did I really say it ........... Damn Trolls are good for something.

Well, I really don't think it's gotten out-of-hand. It's actually been a little better lately, I think. So, I'm hardly gonna go any further than what I have already said on this.

A co-worker of mine got bumped from here, I think cuz he only posted silly stuff. He only joined because of me. He thought he'd have some fun with it. I didn't even know who he was in here until shortly before he got bumped. Y'all did right in bumping him. (I think he thinks I had something to do with it. :D )

So, I don't know how you do it. Moderators-only polls, check sheets, whatever. You said "You don't just up and ban people because you feel like it." Yes you do. Whether willy-nilly, or in some kind of formalized manner, but it boils-down to the fact that those who are bumped were bumped because the moderator(s) "felt like it". And rightfully so in my opinion. Y'all "represent" the rest of us members, so if you "feel like" bumping someone, chances are real good that we do too. Some might disagree, but most (who will mostly almost always remain silent) agree with that action taken. If you get a disagreement from certain members whom you can rely on, such as me (:D jk), then you will know you done messed-up. Then you can undo what was did done done.

It's really just like closing a thread. Same difference.

Go for it. Glad you are one of the moderators, by the way...

There, I'm through now. :cool:

Makes me rather glad I'm not a moderator any more... I'd be hitting a lot of people with a ban stick right off the bat. I have no patience for trolls and people that are here to cause trouble.

One sign, they are gone. If they don't want to participate then they can find another site to do it on. I do that on my site but since I'm now just a spectator here, I sit back and watch the chaos, ask my questions, and make only a few points when the questions arise.

Do people just join these forums who don't own the car just join to complain and cause an argument? I have never joined a forum until owning a RX8. I joined because I wanted to learn more about the car.

Originally posted by myrx8
Do people just join these forums who don't own the car just join to complain and cause an argument? I have never joined a forum until owning a RX8. I joined because I wanted to learn more about the car.

I am in the same boat. I don't think I ever even considered joining one PRE RX8.

Originally posted by myrx8
Do people just join these forums who don't own the car just join to complain and cause an argument? I have never joined a forum until owning a RX8. I joined because I wanted to learn more about the car.

I don't think there's anything wrong with joining a forum before you own the car.

I've used to have a MX-5, only after I've bought it that I stumble across the Miata.net forum. And only then I've realised what would make a good buy and what would not. And since then I've told myself, always check out the respective car forum before getting the car itself.

In this case the RX-8, there are alot of information all over the net and magazines, but I always feel that the most consolidated infomations to be found and learned is on the FORUM.

2 months ago, before I've ordered my 8, I'm already here lurking around for informations, THANKS to this very forum, it confirm my decision.

Originally posted by Racer X-8
...So, I don't know how you do it. Moderators-only polls, check sheets, whatever. You said "You don't just up and ban people because you feel like it." Yes you do. Whether willy-nilly, or in some kind of formalized manner, but it boils-down to the fact that those who are bumped were bumped because the moderator(s) "felt like it"... Because we "felt like it"?, not exactly. There would be alot less people here if each of the moderators banned people because they "felt like it". To be exact, it was because we determined that they broke the established guidelines. Some just get warnings and clarifications on what they did wrong (as well as we can explain them, anyway), and some are extreme enough that they just get banned right away. Yes, we do have a section were we get clarification from other moderators if we aren't clear, so it's not one person's opinion.
Originally posted by myrx8
Do people just join these forums who don't own the car just join to complain and cause an argument? Yes.

And there are alot more trolls that have come here than you would think. It's just that we take care of them as quickly as possible, and remove their "crap".

Originally posted by M-ster
I don't think there's anything wrong with joining a forum before you own the car. No, there is nothing wrong with that. There is nothing wrong with joining a forum for a car that you never plan on owning. Wrong is joining a forum just to create hate and discontent.

---jps

My problem are those who complain about the car and then you find out that don't even drive or own the car. Like alot of those 350Z owners.

Originally posted by myrx8
My problem are those who complain about the car and then you find out that don't even drive or own the car. Like alot of those 350Z owners.

Hey I love the RX-8, and I am a 350Z owner! ;)

Well, don't take this personally, many of the 350Z drivers are talking a lot of trash. I didn't join this forum to argue.

Originally posted by myrx8
Well, don't take this personally, many of the 350Z drivers are talking a lot of trash. I didn't join this forum to argue.

No problem, I understand. I get frustrated also when somebody bashes the 350Z too. Cant blame you for being upset at 350Z owners.

However, I think a lot of Z'ers have respect for the RX-8. I am one of them. I like the RX-8 a lot, in fact, it was on top of my list up there with the Z.

I even defended the RX-8 on a Nissan forum, along with a couple of others. While there is the obligatory die-hard fanatic that will comment that the other brand is a "piece-of-junk" or "uglier than ugly", there are those that appreciate the virtues of other vehicles, irregardless of brand-name.

Anyway, thumbs up from a 350z owner, for having a great vehicle called the RX-8. :)

Originally posted by Tweety-nator


No problem, I understand. I get frustrated also when somebody bashes the 350Z too. Cant blame you for being upset at 350Z owners.

However, I think a lot of Z'ers have respect for the RX-8. I am one of them. I like the RX-8 a lot, in fact, it was on top of my list up there with the Z.

I even defended the RX-8 on a Nissan forum, along with a couple of others. While there is the obligatory die-hard fanatic that will comment that the other brand is a "piece-of-junk" or "uglier than ugly", there are those that appreciate the virtues of other vehicles, irregardless of brand-name.

Anyway, thumbs up from a 350z owner, for having a great vehicle called the RX-8. :)

For statistics sake: how old are you?

Oh!...and BTW, THANKS!...thumbs up are highly appreciated!

Originally posted by Tweety-nator


Hey I love the RX-8, and I am a 350Z owner! ;) AAAHHH!!! A "Z" TROLL!!!!! BAN THE TROLL! BAN THE TROLL! BAN THE TROLL! BAN THE TROLL! BAN THE TROLL! BAN THE TROLL?
my fingers are getting tired...somebody take over...

No, actually, man, Tweety-nator earned my respect when he apologized for making a post in another thread. He didn't even have to, just didn't want to hurt some feelings. Some people might think that to be a sign of weakness. I think it's a sign of level-headed inner strength to back off when you don't even have to. Hats off to Tweety-nator!

Geez, I oughta be a mod, don't you think? :D :p :D ;) :cool:

RX8-TX: I am 31 years young *cough* *cough*. Please dont laugh, I am sensitive about my age. :D

Racer X-8: Thanks! Nice to know that at least someone respects me, even if it is just on the internet :D. Oh by the way, you have my vote as moderator. If you do get to be a mod, can you change my description from being a "member" to a "Z-Troll"? Thanks. :D

Originally posted by Tweety-nator


No problem, I understand. I get frustrated also when somebody bashes the 350Z too. Cant blame you for being upset at 350Z owners.

However, I think a lot of Z'ers have respect for the RX-8. I am one of them. I like the RX-8 a lot, in fact, it was on top of my list up there with the Z.

I even defended the RX-8 on a Nissan forum, along with a couple of others. While there is the obligatory die-hard fanatic that will comment that the other brand is a "piece-of-junk" or "uglier than ugly", there are those that appreciate the virtues of other vehicles, irregardless of brand-name.

Anyway, thumbs up from a 350z owner, for having a great vehicle called the RX-8. :)

After listening to you, I appreciate your info and opinion. I like to say that you stand out as one of the few who have an open mind.

BTW, have you raced a RX8 with your Z?

Originally posted by myrx8


After listening to you, I appreciate your info and opinion. I like to say that you stand out as one of the few who have an open mind.

BTW, have you raced a RX8 with your Z?

I wont get my 350Z until late November, early December(I had to order one). As far as racing the RX-8 in the future, I think I will decline. The Z will be my first manual trans car, so I am going to stink. If I do race an RX-8, the only thing I will see is its tail-pipe as I see it go flying by :D

Nah. Just race pr0ber - the 8 is his first manual too! You might could take him ;)

j/k pr0ber

Back to the original topic, I think you see this kind of phenomenon when a new model is released. I've seen the same type stuff on NASIOC/I-club (subaru boards) when the WRX first came out. For the most part, I think the trolling/negativity will fade in time, although it will never go away. With all the inital positive (and negative) buzz, people usually polarize.
I think people would be less passionate about a less unique car.

So, keep your pants on. It'll calm down eventually.
:)

Originally posted by Tweety-nator


I wont get my 350Z until late November, early December(I had to order one). As far as racing the RX-8 in the future, I think I will decline. The Z will be my first manual trans car, so I am going to stink. If I do race an RX-8, the only thing I will see is its tail-pipe as I see it go flying by :D

Trust me, you wont suck on that car no matter what. And about age, whats the big deal about getting to the 3rd decade of life??...you still have plenty ahead....
Both my sisters are much older than you are...40 & 45

Originally posted by bluesunlion
Back to the original topic, I think you see this kind of phenomenon when a new model is released. I've seen the same type stuff on NASIOC/I-club (subaru boards) when the WRX first came out. For the most part, I think the trolling/negativity will fade in time, although it will never go away. With all the inital positive (and negative) buzz, people usually polarize.
I think people would be less passionate about a less unique car.

So, keep your pants on. It'll calm down eventually.
:)

Absolutely!

I think that all the positive press this car has received put some of the people off. I've driven/owned some cars that got some abysmal press, but I was very happy with my choices. I think the article from Car & Driver didn't do much to make some of the Z/G crowd very happy. Therefore, when news about the HP issue surfaced, those folks jumped all over it.

In a few months, no one will remember anything about THE LETTER except those who it affected.

If all this "hub-bub" was concerning an Accord, Mailbu or a Camry, I doubt there would be nearly as much activity regarding the issues.

Truth told, whenever I run across someone who asks me about my RX8 (which is daily), they have no idea about any controversy. They just like the car. Probably the vast majority of the car buying public has any idea a controversy exists....even those who are shopping for an RX8.

Elara,

I say, let democracy rule. If a large number (pick a number) of people complain about a particular poster who is behaving in a troll-like manner then issue a warning to the troll and hand them the netiquette URL. If the complaints continue ban them. That way the time-wasters, here only for an argument, get tossed. You could even make it work the other way, provide a way for people to vote for their favorite posters, kind of like how people rate contributed amazon.com reviews. That way people would get a sense of how valuable a given poster's comments are. I'm not saying that you ban people because they're having healthy, animated discussion but because they're bothering a large number of people.

The problem I'm having as a mostly-reading-sometimes-posting member is wading through the troll noise. It really makes it hard to find the useful content.

I love this forum and I've learned a lot and I'm happy to be a member, but I do think something needs to be done about the signal to noise ratio.

Originally posted by rex
Elara,

I say, let democracy rule. If a large number (pick a number) of people complain about a particular poster who is behaving in a troll-like manner then issue a warning to the troll and hand them the netiquette URL. If the complaints continue ban them. That way the time-wasters, here only for an argument, get tossed. You could even make it work the other way, provide a way for people to vote for their favorite posters, kind of like how people rate contributed amazon.com reviews. That way people would get a sense of how valuable a given poster's comments are. I'm not saying that you ban people because they're having healthy, animated discussion but because they're bothering a large number of people.

The problem I'm having as a mostly-reading-sometimes-posting member is wading through the troll noise. It really makes it hard to find the useful content.

I love this forum and I've learned a lot and I'm happy to be a member, but I do think something needs to be done about the signal to noise ratio.


YOu have an excellent Idea

aussie77: Thanks for the vote of confidence! :D

RX8-TX: Sometimes I forget that I am posting on an auto forum, not a video card forum. At 31, I am generally regarded as a "fossil" in the gaming community. :D


Back to the original topic, I find it quite perplexing to see the "hate" that some people have for the RX-8... I remember reading user reviews on autos.msn.com, and one user was complaining that the "timing chain broke" on his brand-spanking new RX-8! Ha ha!

I wonder if Mazda warranty covers invisible items like the timing chain. :D

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Tweety-nator
[B]RX8-TX: I am 31 years young *cough* *cough*. Please dont laugh, I am sensitive about my age. :D

Wait a second, I am in the 30's!!!!

Tweety, I'm 30 too and I have to point out how all the young wippersnappers at my local LANparty dont know squat about computers. All they can do is load games and screw the computers up. It's sad.

Damn kids. Back in my day we didnt have all this windows and mac hand-holding. We used DOS and liked it dagnabit! We where suposed to know the heads, sectors and cylinders on our HD's to set them up. None of this plug and play crap.

:cool:

Originally posted by Genom
Tweety, I'm 30 too and I have to point out how all the young wippersnappers at my local LANparty dont know squat about computers. All they can do is load games and screw the computers up. It's sad.

Damn kids. Back in my day we didnt have all this windows and mac hand-holding. We used DOS and liked it dagnabit! We where suposed to know the heads, sectors and cylinders on our HD's to set them up. None of this plug and play crap.

:cool:

Gee, I am 37, and back in my day, we did text advantures and punch cards! Anyone remeber zork?

Genom: Haha! Me and a couple of friends attended a UT LAN party back in 1999, and guess what ... not a single person there had an Anti-Virus program installed on their computer! Hehe. Yeah good old DOS, and setting up the BIOS... you really had to know how your computer worked in order to get it to run. :D

Klegg: I didn't get to use punch cards, my first computer was a dual 5 1/4" floppy system, no Hard Drive, with DOS loaded in floppy Drive A, and all my data in floppy Drive B. Total of 640K of memory, with a "Turbo" button to increase speed from 4.77Mhz to a whooping 12Mhz! My first Zork game was "Return To Zork", but it was a graphical game, not like the original Text based Zork version. Man, you got me beat! :D

Originally posted by Tweety-nator
Genom: Haha! Me and a couple of friends attended a UT LAN party back in 1999, and guess what ... not a single person there had an Anti-Virus program installed on their computer! Hehe. Yeah good old DOS, and setting up the BIOS... you really had to know how your computer worked in order to get it to run. :D

Klegg: I didn't get to use punch cards, my first computer was a dual 5 1/4" floppy system, no Hard Drive, with DOS loaded in floppy Drive A, and all my data in floppy Drive B. Total of 640K of memory, with a "Turbo" button to increase speed from 4.77Mhz to a whooping 12Mhz! My first Zork game was "Return To Zork", but it was a graphical game, not like the original Text based Zork version. Man, you got me beat! :D

My first rig was an osbrone portable and then I went Hi tech with a apple 2C.

Fast forward to my new system:

22 inch Diamondtron Natural Flat CRT .25mm with 1600 x 1200 resolution
Intel® Pentium® 4 processor 2.80GHz with Hyper-Threading
512MB DDR SDRAM
160GB 7200 rpm Ultra DMA hard drive
DVD+RW/CD-RW Combo drive
16x DVD-ROM drive
NVIDIA® GeForce FX 5200 AGP 8X graphics card with 128MB DDR video memory and TV and DVI capabilities
Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 THX® certified 200 watt speakers,5.1 integrated stereo sound system

Boy times have changed

Originally posted by aussie77
ICar and driver, for example. The people who review for these places do it for a living. They could even be called experts! They get to drive more different types of cars in a year than most of us will drive in our lifetimes. They hence experience the absolute latest in technology, the BEST in modern automobiles, and also the worst.

These experts have consistently applauded the RX-8 as a marvellous piece of engineering. In comparison tests they have compared it favorably to most if not all of the 'competing' models in the same price and performance-range. Truth be told, I have yet to read a single negative review from a professional reviewer about this car.


I enjoy the information on this site. However, I take everything I read with a grain of salt. BUT, I will disagree with you a bit on your definition of experts. Remember that these guys have an agenda. It might or might not be in line with yours. I remember that many years ago they had the Chevy Vega as the car of the year. It was a piece of crap (as my sister can tell you).

However, I do think that the RX8 is a very good car and I am not an owner but an interested observer.

You say car reviewers have an 'agenda'. What then would you say about people who come to these boards with no RX-8, no intention of owning an RX-8, who continuously trash the car with their commentary? If we want to talk about agendas....

Besides which, exactly what agenda do the numerous car reviewers who have reviewed the car in a positive light have? Do you think they are getting kick-backs from Mazda? Particularly when the positive things they have to say about the car are the same positives we as owners notice?

Again, the car is not by any means perfect - it is what it is. There are some things on this board I take with a grain of salt. But then there are some people I am learning to just plain ignore. Any regular around here could probably list most of those people in 30 seconds of thought because they are everywhere, and they are relentless in their negativity.

When my RX-3 died, we replaced it with a Chevy Vega. We should have kept the RX-3 on a ventilator or something. Times really have changed -- I'd forgotten about that Vega. Ugh!

Originally posted by Tweety-nator
Genom: Haha! Me and a couple of friends attended a UT LAN party back in 1999, and guess what ... not a single person there had an Anti-Virus program installed on their computer! Hehe. Yeah good old DOS, and setting up the BIOS... you really had to know how your computer worked in order to get it to run. :D

Klegg: I didn't get to use punch cards, my first computer was a dual 5 1/4" floppy system, no Hard Drive, with DOS loaded in floppy Drive A, and all my data in floppy Drive B. Total of 640K of memory, with a "Turbo" button to increase speed from 4.77Mhz to a whooping 12Mhz! My first Zork game was "Return To Zork", but it was a graphical game, not like the original Text based Zork version. Man, you got me beat! :D

My first computer was a trs80 from radioshack. WE spent $400 in 1978 for 16k of ram(not a misprint) We needed a expansion box to put the chips in!! Back then, programs came on tape, took an hour to load a program!

Originally posted by klegg


My first computer was a trs80 from radioshack. WE spent $400 in 1978 for 16k of ram(not a misprint) We needed a expansion box to put the chips in!! Back then, programs came on tape, took an hour to load a program!

I had the same thing! My parents bought us a version of LOGO (if anyone remembers that) and a funky DinoWars game. And huge weird joysticks.

Ahhhhh. LOGO. Must... suppress.. memory... must.. forget.

Ahhhhh. LOGO. Must... suppress.. memory... must.. forget.


Now I feel so ungeeky for a PC-savvy guy that got his first PC in 1995 (I don't count the mac classic nor the brother word processor). But I still ctrl-esc+up+up+enter+cmd+enter into a DOS prompt to do just about everything, does that count? :)
I've been planted in DOS ever since me and a friend finally resorted to figuring out memory management to get Front Page Sports Football Pro 95 working (after he had the game for almost a year without playing it). Some unix experience but wish I had more, but learning stuff about computers on my own isn't quite the same as it was when I was 14-15.

But you guys are pulling out references that get tossed around in my CS night classes by all the OLD people :D "You guys remember the Differential Engine? Crap, that thing never worked right. And Babbage wouldn't return my telegrams!" :)

Its true, some of us are old. Anyone remeber "miner2049er"

bards tale and ultima 1?

The two godfathers of fps, return to castle wolfinstien and ultima underworld?

wing commander 1?

When milk was dropped of on the front porch in bottles?

virgins?

$4.00 for a movie ticket?

space invaders? (thummmmp thummmmp thummmmp)

The two godfathers of fps, return to castle wolfinstien and ultima underworld?


What about Blake Stone? You're making Apogee feel bad :) Wolfenstein was fun. So was Links (pre-Links386 days, even).
Of course I had to experience these at a friends place. I played way too much atari 2600 as a kid - I would play in my sleep on occasion (a couple times even controlling both teams on the baseball game)


I still pay $6.00 for a movie ticket on opening night for a 7:00pm - 10:30pm show, luckily :) No milkman delivery though.

There's a guy on the maxima board in his late 60s I believe. Just bought a G35c in fact. Nifty how generation gaps can lessen over a bulletin board, provided people respect things the right ways :)

Originally posted by aussie77

Besides which, exactly what agenda do the numerous car reviewers who have reviewed the car in a positive light have? Do you think they are getting kick-backs from Mazda? Particularly when the positive things they have to say about the car are the same positives we as owners notice?


Wanna talk kickback? How about advertising? Do you think a manufacturer will continue to advertise their cars in a mag that is constantly trashing them? Do you think that C&D makes all their money off the cost of your subscription? Advertising dollars are king.

How about evaluation cars? If a car magazine has been trashing every car from a given manufacturer, do you really think that manufacturer will put that mag first on the list for a test drive in their hot new car? No, they will make them wait a few weeks until all of the other mags have run their articles.

I don't think the mags are totally corrupt but I do believe that they temper their responses to certain cars based on advertising dollars at risk.

Originally posted by tagS60


Wanna talk kickback? How about advertising? Do you think a manufacturer will continue to advertise their cars in a mag that is constantly trashing them? Do you think that C&D makes all their money off the cost of your subscription? Advertising dollars are king.

How about evaluation cars? If a car magazine has been trashing every car from a given manufacturer, do you really think that manufacturer will put that mag first on the list for a test drive in their hot new car? No, they will make them wait a few weeks until all of the other mags have run their articles.

I don't think the mags are totally corrupt but I do believe that they temper their responses to certain cars based on advertising dollars at risk.

I've seen car & driver say some pretty nasty things about particular vehicles. Not so much the same with Motor Trend or Road and Track. Consumer Reports should stick to reviewing toasters.

Particularly when the positive things they have to say about the car are the same positives we as owners notice?

Besides the negative reviews you see as mentioned above, there is still this. As a source of information magazines such as this also have to protect their credibility. If they answer only to the almighty dollar, what happens when people lose faith in their reviews and stop buying their magazines? NO company will pay to advertise in a magazine nobody buys.

I'm sure the people who voted on the International Engine of the Year award the Renesis won were also receiving kick-backs as well... more than Honda since the Renesis beat out the S2000 engine in the same displacement class. Doh!

Of course I had to experience these at a friends place. I played way too much atari 2600 as a kid - I would play in my sleep on occasion (a couple times even controlling both teams on the baseball game)

Ha, I still play atari. Yep... the 2600 is right there next to the PS2. Plus I am only 23 so its not as much of a nostalgia thing for me, I really think alot of those old games are fun.

-JiM

Originally posted by aussie77


Besides the negative reviews you see as mentioned above, there is still this. As a source of information magazines such as this also have to protect their credibility. If they answer only to the almighty dollar, what happens when people lose faith in their reviews and stop buying their magazines? NO company will pay to advertise in a magazine nobody buys.

I'm sure the people who voted on the International Engine of the Year award the Renesis won were also receiving kick-backs as well... more than Honda since the Renesis beat out the S2000 engine in the same displacement class. Doh!

Of course, I never stated that they answer only to the "almighty dollar," but you do have to take these types of factors into consideration when you read any magazine article.